08
May
12

A Word from Tally: A response to BWD

First I want to thank BWD for her amazing, heartfelt piece on Marriage Equality. Everyone should have that experience, and feel that way. I really feel if more people cared about the happiness and well being of others, this would be a much better world. Perhaps that is all it will take – personal experience.

Alas, we are not there today. In fact I feel that if we’re not careful, and don’t recognize RightWing PropagandaBait when it’s thrown at us (thanks to our GOPWHOREMEDIA™®), we’re going to give this election to the crazies.

I am just about at the end of my rope regarding the shortsightedness of the Left.

I am straight. I never woke up and made a decision that I was going to like men. I just do. It was never a choice.

I was born and raised in Southern California. I grew up in Theatre, and in the Entertainment Industry. It’s hard to avoid if you live here. I have countless friends who are gay. Most of them are in more stable, long-term relationships than my straight friends. Many of them married during the brief window of legality, only to have forces of hate from across the country send in millions of dollars – including donations from Mitt Romney – to fund taking away the rights of other humans they disagree with.

Yes. Marriage (and complete) Equality should be a no-brainer. No one’s marriage has any affect whatsoever on another’s. But what we’ve witnessed during the Prop 8 fight here in California has shown that there are not only a majority on the Right who disagree vehemently with this, and feel the government should be given jurisdiction over who can love and marry whom, there are many on the Left, that for whatever reason, religious or otherwise, also (unfortunately still) feel the same.

Yet today, there is a new groundswell for President Obama to come out before the biggest, most important, and what maybe the most contentious election in my lifetime, in support for repealing DOMA. Of course many Liberal Bloggers who didn’t get their Progressive Pony due to all the GOP and BlueDog obstruction are once again putting their PL EmoProg hats on and whining about every problem President Obama didn’t instantly fix with his Magic Harry Potter Wand™, and have jumped on the End DOMA Yesterday bandwagon, because life wouldn’t be complete without something to complain about.

Take The Nation’s Richard Kim who whines that President Obama has “evolved rightward” on his position on Marriage Equality (subscribe for free for access).

Dear EmoProgs,

Seriously? This is your line in the sand for the most Progressive President in the last 50 years who has done more for LGBT rights than any other President? You want to force him to say more than he already has, and mock him for his stance on it?

Why, exactly? What do you hope you’ll gain? That he’ll come out and say YES, I’m all for getting rid of DOMA before the election? Because……. you think that the LGBT people who will vote for him outnumber the crazies on the Right, and the religious on the Left who disagree? Really? You really think that President Obama will win in a landslide if he does that?

If you honestly believe that, you’re dreaming. If it didn’t work in California for Prop H8te, then it’s not going to work on a National level, and we’ll end up with President Romney who will repeal every single supportive law for LGBT people including DADT, AND then some!

What’s even worse, he will appoint at least THREE SCOTUS judges, who will be überCorporate, überConservative, and überReligious. How is THAT going to help the LGBT community, when in their hearts they want to make it illegal to be gay?

President Obama stated that he is all for “Civil Unions” that afford ALL the rights of straight married couples. Let me share a simple factoid with you: That is EXACTLY what marriage is in the USA – A CIVIL UNION. You can get married all you want in any church, but until you complete a Marriage License and have it signed by someone who is LEGALLY appointed BY THE STATE to marry you, then FILE IT with your STATE CAPITAL, you ARE NOT LEGALLY MARRIED. PERIOD.

Religion has ZERO BEARING on the LEGALITY of MARRIAGE IN THE US.

That makes MARRIAGE = CIVIL UNION.

However, if we push this right now, and President Obama doesn’t get a second term, then Romney will amend the US Constitution and no one alive today will ever see equal rights for the LGBT community.

Let’s get President Obama re-elected, and send him a LIBERAL ARMY that will work WITH HIM, and you will see equal rights and Marriage Equality for everyone during his second term – AND at least THREE LIBERAL SCOTUS JUSTICES.

 It’s the Supreme Court, stupid.

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Links to all of Tally’s posts here

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I know most of you don’t want to hear about this issue any more, so please just ignore this post if you feel that way and let others get on with discussing it. Thanks.


138 Responses to “A Word from Tally: A response to BWD”


  1. 1 nintendowii10
    May 8, 2012 at 4:43 pm

    Excellent post!

    • 2 Betsy
      May 8, 2012 at 7:21 pm

      THank you Tally, I feel the same way, and I’ve been worried about this new hysteria on the left. People are not acknowledging many people who do not agree with church marriage for gays, but civil unions are ok. I do also feel, that this could kill PBO’s re-election, and so I am confident PBO won’t bite. Thanks again.

  2. 4 edp4bho
    May 8, 2012 at 4:46 pm

    Nuf said. !!

  3. 5 FoxfireTX
    May 8, 2012 at 4:48 pm

    Amen Tally!

    • 6 Mel
      May 8, 2012 at 5:35 pm

      Thank, thank you tallay I agreed with you you said it so perfect this wage issue is coming from the right, and
      it seems that the PL is buyig their B.S do the LGTB want to push this issue now and risk everything PBOis done?
      for the gay comunity (If he looses the Election) I I am mad as hell.WE have all ready seen in the last 2 years what
      The GOP and Teaparty are capable of doing If Romney gets Elected with the mayority in the House and Senate,
      not to mention The Suprem Court.

  4. 7 Liberal Librarian
    May 8, 2012 at 4:50 pm

    Okay, get out of my brain, Tally! 😆 This is pretty much the conclusion to my new piece on TPV, which Deaniac will hopefully put up soon.

    • 8 hopefruit2
      May 8, 2012 at 4:51 pm

      Oooh..can’t wait to read it LL…

    • 9 Tally
      May 8, 2012 at 4:54 pm

      Great minds babe!!! 😀

      • 10 Dudette
        May 8, 2012 at 5:39 pm

        Tally, you are ROCK SOLID! So glad you’re on our side!! 🙂

      • 12 nathkatun7
        May 9, 2012 at 12:45 am

        Excellent piece, Tally! I wish people who are pushing President Obama about this would learn some lessons from history. Here is a bit of history that’s been lost by those who are so effusive in praising LBJ for his Civil Rights accomplishments. In 1964, Black folks in Mississippi, after a long and bloody struggle for voting rights, formed an integrated party, the Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party (MFDP). MFDP sent a delegation to the 1964 Democratic Convention to urge the convention to sit them in place of an all white segregationist Mississippi Democratic party. The MFDP’s cause was righteous. But guess who the great LBJ and liberals like Hubert Humphrey and Walter Mondale sided with? They sided with the Mississippi segregationists, basically denying Blacks representation at the Convention. LBJ, who is now the darling of the liberals who relentlessly attack President Obama, sided with the racists, offering Blacks a puny compromise. LBJ and the Democrats didn’t want to loose the the 1964 election. LBJ was elected with strong support from Blacks who could vote. One year later, in 1965, LBJ signed the Voting Rights Act and the Medicare Act.

        I wish people who try to compare the struggle for gay rights with the struggle for black rights would take time to read the long history of black struggle for freedom, which is filled with half measures, backward steps, and betrayals by politicians. Personally, I think President Obama’s record on Civil Rights for gays is unmatched by any of the records of Presidents, from Abraham Lincoln to LBJ, who are always hailed as benefactors for black people. As a student of history, I cringe, for example, when I hear Abraham Lincoln valorized as the Great Emancipator because i know that the myth does square with reality.

        • 13 Tally
          May 9, 2012 at 1:37 pm

          Exactly. I’m hoping yesterdays NC vote was a giant wake-up call as to exactly HOW MUCH HATE there is still in this country.

  5. 14 hopefruit2
    May 8, 2012 at 4:50 pm

    Fantastic!

    Thanks Tally 🙂

  6. 15 debbyeOh
    May 8, 2012 at 4:53 pm

    Thanks Tally! That was through, powerful and beautiful!

  7. 16 hopefruit2
    May 8, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    No wonder UpChuck Toad and Jake Yapper want to keep rehashing VP Biden’s comments 24/7…their puppet isn’t doing so well with the voters…

    • 17 nintendowii10
      May 8, 2012 at 4:55 pm

      They’ll start rehashing old “Biden gaffes,” as if Mitt doesn’t already have a collection of his own gaffes.

    • 18 anniebella
      May 8, 2012 at 5:30 pm

      I need to become a journalists, a real journalists, so I could fine out who’s paying Todd and Tapper.

  8. 20 nintendowii10
    May 8, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    Moving on, the Republicans BLOCKED the student loans bill, quelle surprise!

    THIS Republican Party isn’t the party of Lincoln, it isn’t the party of Teddy Roosevelt, it isn’t the party of Ike, it isn’t even the party of Ronald Reagan.

    It’s the party of Sarah Palin, Michele Bachmann, Herman Cain, Father Rick, and RoboMitt, led by Fox News and right wing AM talk radio. It’s been clear that their ONLY priority is to make President Obama a one term president. Forget about taking care of the country and it’s citizens, they’ve decided that it’s more important to get the scary Muslim Marxist communist Kenyan dog eating black man out of their White House. And to think, that we have a portion of the left, the emoleft, that AGREE!

    I’m not a fan of either party because they have their issues that need resolving. The Republicans have to get back to actually having common sense debate with the Democrats and QUIT LISTENING to Limbaugh, Hannity, and the other tea party right wing loudmouths. The Democrats need to quit being spineless, having in party infights and instead take the fights to the loudmouth Tea Party Republicans who put partisan ideology before the needs of the country. It’s making sense what Barack Obama’s vision for America is, an America where Republicans and Democrats work together and the needs of the nation are met. Instead, we have an America where it’s every politician for themselves, we don’t have the needs of the nation being met, and it’s ALL being blamed on President Obama as if he’s Superman and should be able to leap buildings in a single bound. IMO, we need to elect common sense politicians in both parties who want to put the idea of compromise a regular practice, that is how we get through life.

    Yea that was a bit of ranting as well, hopefully it doesn’t come off sounding too concern trollish 😉

    • May 8, 2012 at 5:02 pm

      “Yea that was a bit of ranting as well, hopefully it doesn’t come off sounding too concern trollish”

      Surprisingly, no 😉

    • May 8, 2012 at 5:09 pm

      Your ranted is all good but until we do something about the media, like I said in 2010 some people still believe the media, All this crazy goes on because the media is uncheck, THE ROOT OF THE PROBLEM IS THE MEDIA, THERE IS NO TRUTH IN THE MEDIA ANYMORE ONLY CRAZY STUFF and BOOK DEALS

      • 23 Left-Indie
        May 8, 2012 at 5:53 pm

        Ditto, Tally. Nintentowee says “I’m not a fan of either party…” Sorry, the two parties are not even in the same planet for easy equivalency.

    • 24 Betsy
      May 8, 2012 at 7:23 pm

      I am very worried about the effect of the increase on my son’s ability to pay back his loans. He’s able to do it now, but not if the increase goes through. I am worried about the impact of this. It breaks my heart.

  9. 25 nintendowii10
    May 8, 2012 at 4:56 pm

  10. 26 gcwp1
    May 8, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    I’m away from home and have poor connectivity, I had no idea about this DOMA/PL attention grabbing nonsense. I am not referring
    to BWD. She Is sincere but wrong, in my opinion. And to. Respond to some dude in the last thread, the comments WERE respectful, I don’t know if C And BWD are. Buying into false, they are simply opinionated as we all are. But the lens must be whether our actions are helpful or not. Whether we proceed because of our own needs or the President’s.

    • 27 Tally
      May 8, 2012 at 5:01 pm

      “But the lens must be whether our actions are helpful or not.”

      Precisely. When an immediate need results in backfiring and making things worse in the long run, then it’s not good. It’s that old “Cut your nose off……” thing, as they say.

    • May 8, 2012 at 5:04 pm

      “the comments WERE respectful, I don’t know if C And BWD are”

      Do you really believe that gcwp?

      • 30 TrumpDog
        May 8, 2012 at 5:14 pm

        if C And BWD are. Buying into false, they are simply opinionated as we all are. But the lens must be whether our actions are helpful or not. Whether we proceed because

        this is the whole sentence. A period looks like it was inadvertently inserted.

        • May 8, 2012 at 5:14 pm

          Ah, okay, thanks TrumpDog.

        • 32 TrumpDog
          May 8, 2012 at 5:17 pm

          I don’t know if C And BWD are buying into false, they are simply opinionated as we all are. But the lens must be whether our actions are helpful or not. Whether we proceed because of our own needs or the President’s.

      • 33 gcwp1
        May 8, 2012 at 5:46 pm

        No, lord no , sorry. I’m a moving car And I suck at typing 😦

  11. 34 utaustinliberal
    May 8, 2012 at 5:01 pm

    Wonderful post Tally. The short sightedness of some on our side is so frustrating. Until Pres. Obama cuts himself and bleeds for us will we say “oh yes, now he’s lockstep with us. Now he has earned our vote.” It’s annoying, it’s depressing, and it makes me mad as hell. Who the heck is anyone to make demands on Pres. Obama? Marriage = Civil Union. He has been the MOST Progressive President on LGBT issues yet some still demand, demand, demand, demand with banshee like voices.

    This happens all the time. ALL THE TIME. Before he gives a policy speech, before a poll comes out, before he has a press conference, before he has an event, before he announces an administration policy. The same hair on fire so called ardent supporters of PBO come out and begin creating discord amongst us so that we fall prey to the latest media nontroversy. We tell ourselves ok, this is the last time. We won’t fall into the trap. Yet the next headless chicken freakout that comes our way, some fall right back into the same cycle. I am tired. I AM TIRED. You think Pres. Obama isn’t progressive enough on LGBT issues? You want him to come out and support same sex marriage and then what? The goal posts move again? You think demanding and dictating to Pres. Obama that he conform to your every value and every wish list that progress will come? Pat yourself on the back for your incredible tunnel vision and huge blind spot. You think Pres. Obama isn’t progressive enough on LGBT issues? Go right ahead and vote for Romney. That’ll surely get you the equality you scream about. While you’re voting for Romney, I hope you also believe that unicorns are real and a pot of gold awaits you at the end of every rainbow.

    The rest of us will be working our behinds off for the MOST PROGRESSIVE PRESIDENT IN DECADES. We have an election to win people. WE HAVE AN ELECTION TO WIN.

    • 35 nintendowii10
      May 8, 2012 at 5:06 pm

      I too have had it with the hair on fire emoprogs who keep whining “President Obama needs to listen to US, we are HIS BASE AND HE ISN’T WINNING RE ELECTION WITHOUT US!” They honestly believe that their get their progressive ponies under a President Romney?

      I believe we should just ignore these emoprogs. Sure, they cost us a majority in 2010, but that was before the Tea Bag Republicans showed themselves for the American hating swine that they are. Let’s move FORWARD onto victory in November.

      FORWARD 2012!!!!

    • 36 itgurl_29
      May 8, 2012 at 5:09 pm

      The minute he says he’s in favor of gay marriage, the same people who were complaining will say it means nothing. And that if he is REALLY for gay marriage, he should marry a man! Only then can they be sure he cares about them!

      I’m so sick of this bullcrap.

      • 37 nintendowii10
        May 8, 2012 at 5:13 pm

        Or worse, they’ll say they MADE him stand up for gay marriage, just like they MADE him repeal DADT and MADE him get out of Iraq… grrrrr! 👿

    • May 8, 2012 at 7:32 pm

      One thing I can appreciate and admire is that you, UT, are a warrior,where PBO and this election is concerned. You are working it out daily on twitter, here, there and verywhere.! Onwards,forward my dear. Power to the people

  12. 39 Tally
    May 8, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    Thanks guys – I’ll be out of e-range for the next couple of hours, but will catch up when I get home.

    xoxoxox

    😀

  13. 40 collegekay
    May 8, 2012 at 5:04 pm

    Well done Tally.
    #Forward

  14. 41 utaustinliberal
    May 8, 2012 at 5:06 pm

    And now for some more good news.

    • 42 nintendowii10
      May 8, 2012 at 5:07 pm

      Think it has any correlation with how angry the people are at Kasich in Ohio?

    • 43 donna dem 4 obama
      May 8, 2012 at 5:32 pm

      Wow! You know our President has a floor of electoral votes of around 248 right now based on polling and if he can get Ohio and Iowa which today both of these states showed polling favoring PBO that will put him at 273 and a re-election win. Of course I want many more EV than 273 because that will ensure the takeback of Congress and a hold on the Senate.

      Boots on the ground to register voters and educate voters on the new ID laws and ultimately GOTV will get us a landslide win this November.

  15. 45 isonprize
    May 8, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    Tally I agree with your post. Here’s the thing…

    Whether people agree or disagree with BWD. Agree or disagree with Tally, our last best hope of getting EQUALITY for all people in the United States is the re-election of Barack Obama as President of these United States. By equality, I mean healthcare equality, equality of opportunity in education, business, arts, entertainment, etc., marriage equality, military equality, equality in the workplace, EQUALITY FOR ALL!!!

    As Bobfr for is fond of saying “AMERICA, THIS IS NOT A TEST” I’ll go even further, we are in the midst of a Civil War without the bullets and the bloodshed. (Well, I take that back, there are bullets and bloodshed. RIP ~~ Women who have died at the hands of abusive partners, Trayvon Martin and countless others, but I digress…)

    We have GOT to keep our eyes on the prize, the larger picture, the very fabric of the nation, is built on us all working together.

    There are some fierce, hateful, well-funded forces at work that want to make sure we DON’T stick together. We can agree to disagree, but in the end, at the time of battle, we can’t run away from the fight. WE MUST MOVE FORWARD TOGETHER. That is the only way we can beat these bastards. THE ONLY WAY. Keep your eyes on the prize.

  16. 48 utaustinliberal
    May 8, 2012 at 5:09 pm

  17. 49 nintendowii10
    May 8, 2012 at 5:09 pm

  18. May 8, 2012 at 5:10 pm

    I have never been able to understand why people don’t get that simple concept. I perform civil unions all the time in corn fields, back porches, front lawns, mountain tops, the altars of nature. They are all legal, have nothing to do with a church, are no more sacred or binding that those performed at the altar of religion and always occur between two people who love each other. Good work Tally both on the president’s stance and the real status of marriage and marriage inequality for those who love same gender partners. I think if we remove the word ‘sex’ from the whole issue and talk simply about people who love each other, we would all be better off.

  19. 51 Ladyhawke
    May 8, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    NOTHING BUT EMPTY RHETORIC

    Rubber Stamp Romney saying he knows how to fix the economy is just like John McCain saying he knows how to get Osama Bin Laden.

    • 52 sherijr
      May 8, 2012 at 5:21 pm

      oooh may I tweet that? I like it 🙂

      • 53 Ladyhawke
        May 8, 2012 at 5:27 pm

        Absolutely, I was going to post a follow-up.

        BOLD AND DECISIVE LEADERSHIP

        President Obama’s bold and decisive leadership rescued the economy and brought Osama Bin Laden to justice. Period. Full Stop.

  20. 55 Bill R.
    May 8, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    Excellent post! Jake Tapper, Ed Henry, Sam Stein, Josh Marshall, Ezra Stein, Greg Sargent, and the rest of the media whores luvvvv to see Dems fighting. And they are doing everything possible in their publishing to provoke it. Most of all, Karl Rove does. It isn’t going to make one fig of difference for the fate of marriage equality for PBO to make a statement. It really isn’t a federal issue. It’s a state by state issue and there is where it is going to be fought. And frankly in some states such a purely symbolic statement by PBO could be the difference between winning and losing,mainly losing, between having three more teabagger appts. on the SCOTUS and three progressive judges who will uphold all the things we stand for. So, for those people who want to see marriage equality, fight it out in your state, where the battle can actually be won. But timing is everything. Here in Oregon, a liberal blue state, some people tried to rush it by getting a liberal judge to order marriage equality. The result was a decision that was overturned and passage of a statewide amendment to the constitution banning gay marriage. That’s not a good outcome for one symbolic gesture. Important thing here that Tally is saying, think and strategically, don’t think from your own righteousness.

    • 56 nathkatun7
      May 9, 2012 at 1:25 am

      On the national level, only the Courts — specifically the U.S.Supreme Court — can decide the Constitutionality of gay marriage. That’s why I am puzzled as to why some people I respect are so obsessed with what President Obama believes. If the Supreme Court ruled tomorrow that state laws that prohibit gay marriages were unconstitutional it really would not matter what President Obama, or any other president, thinks. Gay couple would automatically gain the right to marry. On the other hand, if President Obama called a press conference tomorrow and loudly proclaimed his unequivocal support of gay marriage, not a single gay couple in the vast majority of states that don’t allow gay marriage would be married!

  21. 57 geeja
    May 8, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    Great post Tally. Growing up in the late 50s and 60s in Alabama I know all to well what it is like to feel that things are moving too slow. I also know that this President has been very instrumental in helping the gay community move forward. Do not cut off your nose to spite your face is all to true in this case. A loss for President Obama would be a loss for us all.

  22. 58 Linda
    May 8, 2012 at 5:13 pm

    Romney To Fundraise With Plan B Maker Despite Denouncing Emergency Contraception As ‘Abortive Pills’

    Romney’s Goldman Sachs 2002 Exchange Place Fund, valued at over a million dollars in 2010, brought in nearly $600,000 in gains in 2010 and is invested in:

    – Watson Pharmaceuticals: manufacturer of nine forms of emergency contraception (which Romney incorrectly identifies as “abortifacients“).
    – Johnson & Johnson: launched the first U.S. prescription birth control product in 1931 and produces various forms of birth control.
    – Merck: produces various forms of birth control
    – Mylan: produces birth control medication and filed the first application for a generic birth control pill last year.
    – Pfizer: a contraception producer that recently had to recall about a million packs of birth-control pills that weren’t packaged correctly.

    It appears that Mitt Romney strongly opposes emergency contraception, except when it’s of financial benefit to him or his campaign.

    http://thinkprogress.org/

  23. 59 Linda
    May 8, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    Ha…Chris Matthews just said Mitt’s claim to saving the auto industry

    ” Grand Theft Auto “

  24. 60 utaustinliberal
    May 8, 2012 at 5:14 pm

  25. 61 nintendowii10
    May 8, 2012 at 5:15 pm

  26. 67 MomSense
    May 8, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    Just a point of clarification, the President has said that DOMA is discriminatory and in his opinion unconstitutional. The Justice Dept. has already stopped defending it. So the issue is not about DOMA, it is about whether or not the President says the magic words that he supports gay marriage and not just civil unions and all the rights and responsibilities that go along with civil unions.

    In addition to repealing DADT, his administration already made benefits available for all same sex partners of federal employees (this is huge!!) and has hired more openly LGBT people than any previous administration.

    Listen, I believe with all my heart that we will achieve marriage equality–and soon–but we have to win this election first. And this is not an issue where we need a President to swoop in and do this for us. We will make it happen if we build a movement that will do the painstaking and patient organizing in every neighborhood, city, town, and state until it is done! There are so many of us who believe in human dignity and equality for our LGBT brothers and sisters that it is only a matter of time. The right cannot take this from us if we change hearts and minds through patient and constructive education and example. We will fail if we get distracted and divided. Keep the faith everyone. We will get there.

    • 68 gn
      May 8, 2012 at 6:43 pm

      The POTUS has also, in response to an awful story about bigots working at a hospital denying a partner access to her dying wife, made it mandatory that any hospital taking federal funds cannot deny same sex partners access to their loved ones (and with Medicare/Medicaid and various and sundry federal funding programs, that’s a good slice of the health care universe). I have watched numerous items such as this dismissed as “nothing,” swept under the rug in favor of a purity narrative which posits that POTUS must do a,b,c and features moving goalposts. As an unequivocal fan of bwd, I disagreed with her piece and hope that people consider Tally’s reasoned plea here.

      • 69 MomSense
        May 8, 2012 at 8:30 pm

        Yes!! I agree with you that tying access to partners for hospitals, etc that receive medicare funding was brilliant. It ended a terrible practice. Our President certainly doesn’t get the credit he deserves for many things.

        I really like BWD and thought her letter was respectful. I guess I am just in the thick of campaigning in my state so I am dealing with the challenges we face in this election. We have made tremendous progress on LGBT rights and I don’t want to jeopardize it by becoming divided now.

      • 70 nathkatun7
        May 9, 2012 at 1:56 am

        Well said MomSense and GN! The things you listed that the President has done are concrete and benefit real gay people. President Obama telling the media, which are nothing but Republican propaganda mouthpieces, would not result in a single gay couple getting married. Period. As heartfelt and moving as BWD’s story was, her solution is more about symbolism rather than substance. What if President Obama says the magic words that he supports gay marriage and gay couples are still denied marriage licenses in NC, VA, PA, MS, TX, etc.? Will the new goalpost be that President Obama is not pushing hard enough to order those states to marry gay couples? Or will it be that he did not issue an executive order to overturn DOMA? There are people who so naive to believe that a president can issue an executive order to overturn a law passed by Congress and signed into law by a president, which is exactly what DOMA is.

  27. 71 aquagranny911
    May 8, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Tally, I have read the diaries and all the comments here & I have only one question. If BWD is so passionate on this particular issue why didn’t she use her own blog for her screed rather than igniting a shit storm at TOD?

    • 72 hopefruit2
      May 8, 2012 at 5:31 pm

      Chips decided to post the letter, and ultimately it’s Chips decision as to what she will or won’t post on her blog. Don’t have a problem with BWD or anyone else expressing their views – but I feel equally passionate about my view which is that the President should not be forced into some kind of superficial decision just to satisfy emotional needs/fantasies, particularly when there are much bigger more serious issues at stake in an election year.

      • 73 aquagranny911
        May 8, 2012 at 5:55 pm

        Chips chooses what she posts but BWD is a grown up person who can also choose what she posts & she has her own blog, albeit unused for a while. Everyone is entitled to express his or her own opinion. My opinion is this was a colossal waste of energy that played right into MSM & PL BS that seeks controversy, divisiveness & slamming our Prez. Sorry, but I have no patience for this at all.

        • 74 hopefruit2
          May 8, 2012 at 6:50 pm

          I don’t think it’s for you or I to say where BWD chooses to express her opinion!
          She said what she had to say, many people disagreed, some agreed. People who come here get to read a sampling of both sides – they also get to see the comments/opinions of those who strongly disagreed with BWD’s perspective (e.g., mine, Ut’s others). And I’m almost certain that BWD has read most of the comments – esp. those that differ from her initial point of view. Even if she doesn’t immediately change her mind, It might help to broaden her perspective on this issue, and I think that’s healthy.

          • 75 aquagranny911
            May 8, 2012 at 6:58 pm

            OH Please! When LL posts a diary, he get’s a shout out not a reprint of his whole diary here. And by your lights I can also express my opinion which I have done. I’m tired of the drama & I have better things to do. Peace & have a good evening.

            • 76 hopefruit2
              May 8, 2012 at 7:03 pm

              LL blogs on a specific site over at The People’s View, but . Tally (and sometimes Japa21) long posts are also printed as separate threads. I think it has to do with the length of the post and if there is a special issue of concern for the poster. Have you read Tally’s post – it was also very passionate, and many people (including myself) agreed with her.

              Peace and have a good evening.

    • 77 Tally
      May 8, 2012 at 8:58 pm

      This is how I see it:

      If BWD’s gorgeous letter got ONE PERSON to rethink their stance on Marriage Equality, then MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.

      😀

  28. 79 donna dem 4 obama
    May 8, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Excellent Tally!

  29. May 8, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    thank you so much, tally

  30. 81 hopefruit2
    May 8, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Oh boy, have another helping of “Obama is..” dinner from Little Nate!

    • 82 sherijr
      May 8, 2012 at 5:36 pm

      what a fool. Seriously? where do they even come up with crap… oh yeah- republicans.

  31. 83 utaustinliberal
    May 8, 2012 at 5:24 pm

    Methinks a very stoned George Bush is the same as a not stoned George Bush. 😉

  32. 84 lamh35
    May 8, 2012 at 5:25 pm

    Thank you Tally.

  33. 86 lamh35
    May 8, 2012 at 5:27 pm

    BTW, I saw Ron Reagan on Tweety today and thank goodness for former Mayor Willie Brown of SanFran, cause Ron’s smugness was pissing me off. I just have one question for Ron Reagan. What was President Reagan’s PUBLIC position on gay marriage.

  34. 89 utaustinliberal
    May 8, 2012 at 5:29 pm

    This is what Romney’s business experience leads to.

  35. 90 isonprize
    May 8, 2012 at 5:35 pm

    I’m out to a community meeting.

    Chica, if you are reading this. I hope you don’t shut this place down. It would be great loss if you do! GREAT LOSS. Folks are supersensitve. But this is and has been a place where I (and many others) get better news and coverage of the President of the United States than most “news” channels. I have special place for you because you captured my son shaking hands with Pres. Barack Obama. the best president of my lifetime.

    I hope you decide to keep it going. But if you don’t, I’m sure we will all carry on. I will carry on even fiercer (is that a even a word? 🙂 ), working to get more future voters for Pres. Barack Obama.

    Keep your eyes on the prize. Peace.

    • 91 donna dem 4 obama
      May 8, 2012 at 5:51 pm

      Is Chips considering shutting down the blog?

      Did I miss something?

      • May 8, 2012 at 6:06 pm

        No Donna, things just got a little heated today, I said that if someone like BWD, who has taken nothing but abuse over the years for her support of PBO, was hounded out of here for expressing her sincere opinion on an issue, while still passionately supporting PBO, then I’d wouldn’t be too sure I’d want to hang around here either. Deep breaths all ’round, we’ll see how things go.

        • 93 57andfemale
          May 8, 2012 at 6:28 pm

          This is what the rabid right wants — us tearing each other apart.

          When did it stop being possible to disagree without tearing each other to pieces? BWD’s piece was heartfelt, sincere, thoughtful and inspirational. She came to a different conclusion than I did or Tally did about how it should affect our priorities going forward. When we take our cues on how to treat each other from the likes of Glenn Greenwald and FDL, we’re in trouble. We need to back up, listen to each other, respect each other, be tolerant of each other while never taking our eyes off the most important goal of reelecting PBO and giving him a decent Congress. If we believe we can make a persuasive argument, as BWD did , then we should feel free to make it. I have always believed that there should be room to disagree with policy and have a substantive conversation. That should actually help move the ball down the progressive field. We cannot treat each other the way conservatives treat us.

          And we cannot fall for the bait. But we have. Progressive media has. We don’t need this, we can’t afford this.

          And we certainly cannot afford losing Chips or BWD, who have been such an inspiration to all of us. Bless you.

          • May 8, 2012 at 6:48 pm

            Thank you 57andfemale, you found the words for what’s in my head. I understand, completely, the argument that we shouldn’t allow ourselves be manipulated by opponents of PBO, on the right, far left and in the media, by focusing on potentially divisive issues that they are trying to hype. But equally, I’d love to think we could respect each others’ feelings on issues that really matter to us without questioning our support of PBO or being personally nasty. Whatever people feel about BWD’s stance on this issue, I don’t think they should ever forget what a passionate supporter of the President she has always been and still is. The abuse she has received over the years, at DK, on her own blog and on Twitter, has been venomous at times, but she never gives up and never gives in. Most people today acknowledged that, even while disagreeing with her, some didn’t. It was their responses I found so depressing.

            • 95 LadyTNT
              May 8, 2012 at 7:01 pm

              I hope I’m not overstepping, but I love this place and though there was a lot of heated discussion here today, I don’t think any of the conversation was disrespectful. With all due respect to BWD, you can’t post an opinion and not know that there are going to be people who support and those that don’t, especially in the environment of openess you have created Chips. I think everyone was in their feelings today, which is understandable because this is such an important election. It’s PERSONAL!! We NEED this man and we NEED this blog!!

              I think Nospin’s statement on the prior thread also is worthy of being repeated:

              nospin
              May 8, 2012 at 5:17 pm
              “What the heck. Don’t even think about it Chips. We love both you and BWD.

              Family can passionately disagree and then we make up right away. That is how we roll.

              I think at the core of the issue we are all committed to equality for all people. We may not walk lock step 100% but that doesn’t mean we don’t care for each other and that doesn’t mean that concerns are not real. But this site has afforded the opportunity for us to create a dialogue.

              Through all the heated debate I appreciated the fact that you actually have a community of people from all walks of life being willing to speak out on the isssue in this forum. That is a BFD. That is because of you.

              Yes, we went off the rails a little bit. Things got rowdy but C’mon now. Girl you can’t walk away. We won’t let you.
              We are a family.

              Do you know how high you and your blog are held in the estimation by the AA community? I have seen people share their thoughts and experiences in a way that we do not do outside of our own communities. But it is done here on the regular because of the climate you have created. That is a BFD.

              We celebrate the highs and even after the lows, we pull through together.

              Everyone agrees to equal rights. Every one rejects and denounces discrimination in our laws. There is still work to do in terms of bridging that final gap but with a community like this one, we can do it. Look, we love each other regardless of skin color, gender , country of origin and even sexual orientation.

              What triggered the push back was that most were taken aback by the willingness to latch onto the meme that after all that PO has done to support equality for LGBTs (regardless of his personal feelings on the issue), it was easy to push his accomplishments aside and state that because he was a black man, the fact that he would not say the words I support gay marriage and not just civil unions, that all his accomplishments and the accomplishments of this administration was not good enough. It was difficult to see that even on this blog PO was still prone to be emasculated to serve the needs of Miss Ann. What he is, what he does and all his hard work and dedication meant nothing if he didn’t do what he was told to do when he was told to do it. In fact, it went so far as to accuse PO of being on the wrong side of the last big civil rights issue”.

              Those statements opened some wounds but the positive aspect was that folks were mostly respectful and talked about it. These discussions are tough. But if we continue to have them we will continue to move forward. That said, please recognize that as a country we have come a long way Chips. We really have and we still have a way to go but we will get there. We have to stay together.

              Pamelabrown53. My apologies to you. We love you dearly, and I am sorry if I contributed to any pain.”

              • May 8, 2012 at 7:11 pm

                Thanks so much LadyTNT. It’s true, neither me nor BWD, based on the discussion here yesterday, was under any illusion about what the reaction might be to her post, but I still hoped for some healthy debate. I think 99% of it was, I just thought the rest of it was plain ugly.

                Thanks again LadyTNT, you never overstep, post any thoughts you have here, I always appreciate them.

                • 97 peti4-44
                  May 8, 2012 at 7:49 pm

                  I just don’t understand this whole debate. President Obama himself always asks for different opinions of his staff. He appreciates if someone speaks out what he honestly believes. That is one reason why I utterly adore this man. So there is no reason to pounce on each other just because of different opinions – and again: you all know, where hhe staands in this case.

                • 98 LadyTNT
                  May 8, 2012 at 8:15 pm

                  I understand. Thank you so much for everything that you do. We need you and I know you didn’t necessarily ask for that burden. Let’s see this thing thru until Nov. 6th.

                  Thanks again!

  36. 99 forward44
    May 8, 2012 at 5:36 pm

    Sorry to butt in as a long time lurker, but Tally, I think you are mistaken when you think that President Obama has not come out against DOMA. He HAS, numerous times, he has confirmed they’re working on its repeal in Congress, he had it clearly on his candidate platform right along with repeal of DADT, and he has called it ” an abhorrent law”, among other things. The question here from emoprogs is not that he hasn’t come out against DOMA, but they simply want him to verbally state that he’s “pro-gay marriage”.

    I mean, even places like the Huff had reported back in 2011, when there was a bill that seemed like it would pass Congress that would’ve effectively annulled DOMA, that the President was in support of it. His support for the repeal of DOMA has never been the question, imo.
    That’s why this outrage makes little sense, they KNOW exactly where he stands legislatively, yet they still want something symbolic, like the words “marriage” from him.

    Correct me if I’m mistaken, but as long as I’ve followed PBO since his candidacy, I have not once heard him shy away from denouncing DOMA.
    I think he even did it back in 1996 when it was passed and he was only a state legislator.

    Here’s one of the latest instances, which assures me that the left could not have forgotten that he’s pro-DOMA repeal:
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/19/obama-defense-of-marriage-gay-rights_n_903680.html

    • 100 forward44
      May 8, 2012 at 5:49 pm

      Politifact even still has it as “in the works”, recognizing that repeal is “impossible now with a Republican House”, but that it is indeed on the President’s agenda since his candidacy.

      http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/promise/294/support-repeal-of-the-defense-of-marriage-act/

    • 101 Tally
      May 8, 2012 at 9:15 pm

      You completely misunderstood my piece. I suggest you reread ALL OF IT. I never ever said PBO “had not come out against DOMA.”

      I know he has. I know he has instructed the Justice Dept to also not support DOMA… just like he did with DODT.

      What PBO has or hasn’t said, isn’t the issue. It’s the PL EmoProgs insisting he use their specific wording RIGHT THIS FUCKING MINUTE otherwise they’ll encourage everyone to stay home and NOT VOTE in Nov.

      I have to be honest, I’m rather blown away that was your take on what I wrote.

      • 102 forward44
        May 9, 2012 at 3:40 am

        Well, I’ve read ALL OF IT, three times again, and I’m sorry, but this part of it seemed to me you were referring to DOMA:

        “Yet today, there is a new groundswell for President Obama to come out before the biggest, most important, and what maybe the most contentious election in my lifetime, in support for repealing DOMA. Of course many Liberal Bloggers who didn’t get their Progressive Pony due to all the GOP and BlueDog obstruction are once again putting their PL EmoProg hats on and whining about every problem President Obama didn’t instantly fix with his Magic Harry Potter Wand™, and have jumped on the End DOMA Yesterday bandwagon, because life wouldn’t be complete without something to complain about.”

        I’m actually blown away that I keep reading this sentence and it clearly talks about DOMA, yet you’re blown away that that would be my take on it. Help me out if there’s something I’m missing. I mean that sincerely.

        • 103 forward44
          May 9, 2012 at 3:52 am

          I left out this quote too:

          “Why, exactly? What do you hope you’ll gain? That he’ll come out and say YES, I’m all for getting rid of DOMA before the election? “

        • 104 forward44
          May 9, 2012 at 7:16 am

          Anyway, it’s not even important anymore, really. All I was trying to say is that the emoprogs know very well where PBO stands on DOMA and know damn well that if he had the votes in Congress he would pass the repeal even before the election, and that in fact an attempt was made and came close last year. That’s all.

          • 105 Tally
            May 9, 2012 at 2:16 pm

            Exactly.

            I never said I wasn’t “referring to DOMA.” I clearly was.

            You accused me of saying, “Obama hasn’t come out against DOMA.”, which I never said, that’s all.

            Let me try to explain better…. The article from The Nation which is linked in the piece, (which is what I was referring to), said that President Obama has “evolved rightward” on his Marriage Equality stance. I disagree. He has stated clearly that he is for “Civil Unions that give ALL rights as married couples”, and gone as far as instructing the Justice Dept to stop defending DOMA.

            The entire problem in this country regarding this issue is VERBIAGE (that and the irrational fear of homosexuals.) People are über hung up on the word MARRIAGE, and don’t understand the law.

            Marriage IS a Civil Union in the United States. Period. Which is why Obama brilliantly stated it the way he did. “ALL RIGHTS.” The problem is, “Civil Unions” aren’t equal to “Marriage” in this country. The states that allow “Civil Unions”, those “UNIONS” are specific, and do not allow all of the same rights. In fact, you have to hire an attorney if you want a “Civil Union”, which is ridiculous since the only expense you have regarding a “MARRIAGE” is the Marriage License, and filing fee, which is minimal ($50 or less.) President Obama is not for the “Civil Unions” as they have been written, because they do NOT allow equal rights.

            So many ignorant (and mostly religious) people think there is some magic that comes with the word “Marriage”, and have used every rationale to defend that – making babies, it hurts or straight marriage, or – some wacko called in to Stephanie Miller this morning and said, “it dilutes the institution of marriage.” As if MORE people getting married makes marriage weaker???? Who the fuck knows….. made absolutely no sense, which none of their arguments do.

            A LOT of PL EmoProgs this week, including, shockingly enough, and much to my sadness, Ron Reagan Jr, have come out and insisted that NOW, RIGHT FUCKING NOW THIS MINUTE, President Obama should “Man Up” and take a strong stance on dumping DOMA.

            The GOP would love nothing more than for PBO to do just that.

            The President cannot simply dump DOMA himself. Congress or the judiciary must do that.

            Bottom line:
            – There will be NO ADDITIONAL RIGHTS coming from the GOP – NOT EVER. This Congress especially.
            – If President Obama came out TODAY at a press conference and said, “WE MUST REPEAL DOMA NOW”, especially after the astounding vote yesterday in NC, it would be CHRISTMAS for the GOP, and they would RUN that 24/7, that OBAMA IS FOR THE GAYS, HATES THE SANCTITY OF MARRIAGE, WANTS TO TEACH HOMOSEXUALITY IN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL, WANTS YOUR CHILDREN TO BE GAY, IS FOR THE HOMOSEXUAL AGENDA, He’s SHOVING HOMOSEXUALITY DOWN OUR THROATS! …etc… and every other rightwing crazy thing they said here in CA in 2008 – which is HOW Prop 8 passed in the most liberal state in the country.

            That alone, would most likely tank President Obama’s reelection. We’d get Pres Romney, who has promised:

            – A Constitutional Amendment banning Marriage Equality NATIONALLY.
            – Reinstating DODT.

            He would most likely also try to ban gays from adopting, getting health care of any kind, teaching, working in food service… gods, what else… whatever they could to work on making it ILLEGAL to be OUT. That is their wet dream.

            Prop 8 will go to the USSC – where it will likely be ruled unconstitutional. That will hopefully be that for repealing ALL marriage bans.

            People need to get over their emotional, romantic attachment to the word “Marriage.” Most people think “Marriage” is all about love and fairy-tale endings, etc…. when in reality, it’s about PROPERTY RIGHTS, and legally joining two estates. That’s it. Marriage has NOTHING to do with sex – not legally. Yes, infidelity is grounds for divorce, but that’s only because it can jeopardize property rights by giving an illegitimate child an inadvertent claim to the estate.

            However, proof from yesterday in NC, hatred and bigotry are alive and thriving here in the USA in 2012.

  37. 106 nospin
    May 8, 2012 at 5:38 pm

    “President Obama stated that he is all for “Civil Unions” that afford ALL the rights of straight married couples. Let me share a simple factoid with you: That is EXACTLY what marriage is in the USA – A CIVIL UNION. You can get married all you want in any church, but until you complete a Marriage License and have it signed by someone who is LEGALLY appointed BY THE STATE to marry you, then FILE IT with your STATE CAPITAL, you ARE NOT LEGALLY MARRIED. PERIOD.

    Religion has ZERO BEARING on the LEGALITY of MARRIAGE IN THE US.

    Exactly. So there is no need for the President to say it in order to pass yet another litmus test.

    Thanks Tally. If we look at the responses objectively over the last few threads we are not divided on the issue at all.

    Anyhoo everybody. Bringing over the video I posted in the Bit n Pieces thread.

    I love you Chipstics, BWD and PamelaBrown53. Lets stay together.

  38. 107 Ladyhawke
    May 8, 2012 at 5:40 pm

    THAT’S EXACTLY WHAT I WAS THINKING:

    Daniel Gross Daniel Gross ‏ @grossdm

    ——————————-

    Hard to see how someone who left public office 1/07 and hasn’t had job or exec position since can claim credit for anything that’s happened

    ——————————–

    • 108 Tally
      May 8, 2012 at 9:19 pm

  39. 109 nintendowii10
    May 8, 2012 at 5:43 pm

    And once again, Huff n Puff thinks POT is the biggest issue, and it’s President Obama waging war on pot.

    Their main has a sign with President Obama’s picture that reads as follows:

    Attention all patients!
    On May 6, this medical marijuana center will be closed and will no longer be able to provide you with your medicine.

    By order of the Obama administration

    I’m not surprised at the headline, because Ms HuffnPuff has made it blatantly obvious she despises President Obama and sold her blog to AOL, I’m just astonished that people believe that medicinal marijuana is a bigger issue than student loans and fixing the economy.

    • 111 57andfemale
      May 8, 2012 at 6:14 pm

      Well, the Obama administration has been very aggressive against medical marijuana. I strongly disagree with the policy Doesn’t mean I will let me disagreement with the administration on this affect my vote or my working to get PBO reelected. We should be able to disagree with policy without doing damage.

    • 112 Tally
      May 8, 2012 at 9:24 pm

      OMFGODS. Maybe that needs to be my next rant. The ignorance regarding the WAR ON HEMP (not the smokable stuff) by the Pot Enthusiasts is staggering. And if the Doctors hadn’t written the scrips for everything from hang nails to labor pains, we wouldn’t have these problems right now.

      And the WAR has been waged by the fucking LUMBER LOBBY since R. Hearst was a hottie, and now has been helped along by BIG PHARMA.

      ok – I can’t start on this now, my hair will fall out.

  40. 116 utaustinliberal
    May 8, 2012 at 5:48 pm

  41. 117 Dudette
    May 8, 2012 at 5:52 pm

    Off-topic: 55-year grandmother tries out for Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders
    http://www.foxsportssouthwest.com/05/05/12/Grandma-auditions-for-Cowboys-Cheerleade/msn_landing.html?blockID=724042&ocid=ansfox11

    Talk about motivational! “Get it mama” indeed!

    Dear Lord, please help me get to the gym tonight!

  42. 118 Me4obama
    May 8, 2012 at 5:53 pm

    Thank you Tally. You just made my day complete. I agree with you 100% & I also stood up & gave Chris Mathews a big round of applause on his commentary regarding this issue.

  43. May 8, 2012 at 5:53 pm

    And, the President is For States choosing on this Matter/issue.
    So, on the Day NC is to Choose, the President is supposed to choose for them???
    Really?
    Silly Emoprogs, Trix is for Kids!

  44. 121 lamh35
    May 8, 2012 at 6:01 pm

    Chips et al, if you missed it. ya’ll should watch Tweety’s Let Me Finish segment from today. It would be a perfect bookend to the big discussion from today!

  45. 122 57andfemale
    May 8, 2012 at 6:11 pm

    Perfect, Tally. As perfect as it gets. I really needed for my mental health to stay out of this fray, and I deeply appreciate you articulating exactly what I feel.

    Except for the Southern California part, my background is very similar to yours. I’ve been in theatre all of my life, my brother was gay, my nephew is gay, I have been active for gay rights my entire life. To use a cliche, my best friends are gay but that is literally true. I want marriage equality deeply.

    It’s coming. Attitudes are changing and because of the framework that Barack Obama has laid, it will come a hell of a lot sooner than later. But to jeopardize this election over it is as thoughtless, childish and mean-spirited for the common good as anything I have ever seen. The notion of the emoprogs who think this would actually happen under any current Republican Congress or President is either delusional or intellectually dishonest. that this particular meme has gained acceptance on the Left confounds common sense.

    When the Washington Monthly did their series on “What if Obama Loses?”, of all the thoughtful ideas put forth one in particular stands out to me: “This time they mean it.” This is no longer a ploy to string along the rabid right. This time they mean it. They have meant it since PBO came into office and they have destroyed the credit worthiness of the United States, continue to destroy the economy for political gain, and keep decent judges on all levels of the judiciary from taking their rightful place and serve as a counter to the packed courts of GWB.

    We will lose Medicare. We will lose Medicaid. If HCR survives, it will be obliterated. There will be no Dept. of Ed, no EPA, no regulations on our food, medicines, Wall St. or the banks, or clean air and water. We will cease to be the United States of America. Yes, this time they mean it.

    To jeopardize that because it will take another 6 years or so to achieve marriage equality is too dear a price to pay. The price will be horrific and I, at 62 years old, will not be around to see if this country recovers.

    I understand how deeply this issue touches progressive hearts. I also know that the best way to achieve what you want is to support this President and give progressivism at least the next decade to undo conservative destruction. It took conservatives over 30 years to get here — they promised reversal of Roe v. Wade since it was passed, built coalitions of Republicans willing to wait and most important, willing to vote reliably until they got their ugly wet dream of a hate-filled, education-averse, racist America. We can’t wait 10 days. It’s outrageous.

    • 123 theo67
      May 8, 2012 at 6:53 pm

      Your post sent a chill down my spine. It’s all true. Perfectly chlling: “this time they mean it”. And the whole world will be impacted, once again.

    • 124 daiseymay1
      May 8, 2012 at 7:18 pm

      Your post is so mind stopping and accurate. We can not hcoose our favorite causes and loose sight of the big picture. Now we must reelect PBO. All else will follow.

  46. 125 theo67
    May 8, 2012 at 6:37 pm

    Thank you, Tally. Very well said.

    I missed all the drama today because of work, but I was actually quite happy to see both BWD and Tally’s somewhat opposing opinions displayed for people to consider, debate and discuss – not sure if there was anguish… I hope not. In any case, it’s a testament to the complexity of this issue, but the deep thinkers and feelers on this blog. And from what I’ve seen – both sides of the topic are vehemently supporting President Obama, and fighting for his re-election.

    I have a question though: if Mitt Romney is the one that has vowed to amend the Constitution to cement discrimination against gay people, and he’s the one who allowed his gay staffer to be run out of his campaign – why is the attention on President Obama, who has enacted over 75 things in favor of gay people and equality? Shouldn’t Romney be the one in the hot seat? Innocent question…

    • 126 0388jojothecat
      May 8, 2012 at 8:04 pm

      The GOP is the party of “Gay Hate” thus there is no “story” there. The empogs and the PL along with the celebrities that play journalist and pundits on teevee, have gotten their orders from the RW Corporate Media Heads to stir up faux outrage over PBO and gay marriage. They knew who would take the bait. I don’t know if it was a trial balloon by VP Joe Biden or maybe to get the issue out early so it won’t come up in say October. Get all the “hot button” topics out of the way early so we can go back and focus on the economy and jobs come September.

    • 127 LDS
      May 8, 2012 at 9:05 pm

      Theo67, my sentiments exactly. I posted that same question here earlier. I am sorry if I offended anyone during my interjections to agree or disagree. But the “civil rights” comment just hit home real hard. As an AA who grew up in the south, what most people do not realize growing up with that type inequality all of your life leaves emotional scars that may take the rest of your life to find peace within.
      Not only you but generations of loved ones who shed blood, loss limbs, dignity, pride who did not live to see POB accomplish so much in so little time with so much adversity.

      As an AA woman, there are so many things I take for granted.The little things makes me sad to know that my hard working mother and aunts did not experience. Decent health care is top on my list.

      I will fight has hard as I can to help get this President get re-elected so that other young women and older women will not have to go through the injustices they endured. This President has made a difference. We cannot afford to let this one slip through our fingers. We may not get another chance. This is serious!

  47. 128 nospin
    May 8, 2012 at 7:16 pm

    Hardball Ron Reagan and former San Francisco Mayor Willie Brown

    Debate captures both sides of our discussions

    http://video.msnbc.msn.com/hardball/47345555#47345555

  48. 129 a4alice
    May 8, 2012 at 7:17 pm

    Thanks Tally!

  49. 130 auni
    May 8, 2012 at 7:33 pm

    Tally–once again you put it together. Thanks! We are going to have our ups and down around here for the next few months. There is just so much riding on this election. So here we are–deep cleansing breaths, let our bodies relax–and then get up and beat the hell out of the other side!!!

  50. May 8, 2012 at 8:23 pm

    Thank you Tally for bringing us back to the reality-based community!

  51. May 8, 2012 at 8:34 pm

    Wait, I thought this about having Pres. Obama say that he is for gay marriage. He’s already come out against DOMA and will repeal it in a heartbeat if he had a Congress that would help him. Plus the DOJ has stopped defending it. This is why I don’t get the outrage. How much more can he say? He’s doing everything in his power already and saying he’s for gay marriage is not going to bring us any closer to gay marriage equality. A Democratically controlled congress will. A left leaning Supreme Court will. Does anyone really think that given the opportunity to make gay marriage legal that Pres.Obama would get in the way or refuse to sign such a bill?

    • 133 Tally
      May 8, 2012 at 9:31 pm

      EXACTLY.

    • 134 nospin
      May 9, 2012 at 9:18 am

      “Wait, I thought this about having Pres. Obama say that he is for gay marriage. How much more can he say?”

      they want the President to say the actual words. I am for gay marriage. Not — I am for Civil Unions, ending discriminatory laws that prevent equal rights for all citizens regardless of sexual orientation. The legislations passed and any work in progress to end those discriminatory practices and laws do not count.

  52. 135 carla4obama
    May 8, 2012 at 8:53 pm

    Thank you Tally..can we al breathe and focus now on getting our President re-elected! We need one another, if we are divided we are doomed.
    My hate and repulsion for the GOP is all I need to turn the page and move forward.

  53. May 8, 2012 at 10:09 pm

    I love coming here, but today’s back & forth does absolutely nothing to advance the ONE IMPORANT ISSUE – the RE_ELECTION of PRESIDENT OBAMA. PERIOD.

  54. May 8, 2012 at 11:01 pm

    Great post! OBAMAhas accomplished so much with so many strikes against him e.g. GOP controlled House, partisan Congress, Conservative majority on the Supreme Court. With all the “influence” money spent to spin anything Obama as negative, it’s a miracle he’s accomplished what he has. No wonder we have to counter the negative spin by reminding our citizens whhere his interests lay. It’s not with the 1%.


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