‘polling 100 occupy wall street protesters’

NY Mag: We polled 100 protesters ….

What do you think of Obama?

I believed in him, and he let me down: 40
He’s doing great: 1
I never believed in him: 27
He’s doing the best he can: 22

Did you vote in the 2010 midterm elections?

Yes: 39
No: 55
No, but only because I wasn’t 18: 5

Rank yourself on the following Scale of Liberalism:

Not liberal at all: 6
Liberal but fairly mainstream (i.e., Barack Obama): 3
Strongly liberal (i.e., Paul Krugman): 12
Fed up with Democrats, believe country needs overhaul (i.e., Ralph Nader): 41
Convinced the U.S. government is no better than, say, Al Qaeda (i.e., Noam Chomsky): 34

Full article here

Thanks Fred

199 Responses to “‘polling 100 occupy wall street protesters’”

  1. 1 Fred
    October 12, 2011 at 4:45 pm

    I think the %55;40;and Nader says it all doesn’t it? 🙄

    • 2 nathkatun7
      October 12, 2011 at 5:02 pm

      We are beginning to see the truth about OWS. Only 1 % think the President is doing a good job. Hopefruit was absolutely right about this movement.

      • 3 hopefruit2
        October 12, 2011 at 8:57 pm

        Just got home not too long ago to see this drama…LOL Nathan…I’m not shocked by these figures, but I wish I was wrong. Also I’m curious as to where Jovie got the info that Matt Taiibi conducted the poll. I’m curious because the same Taiibi apparently has written for the company’s magazine (AdBusters).

    • 4 Vicky
      October 12, 2011 at 5:06 pm

      How did the researchers ensure the randomness of their sample? I wouldn’t accept a nonrandom sample from a freshman. Do they explain their sampling procedure?

      • October 12, 2011 at 5:16 pm

        It was Matt taiibi, he did the polling.

        • October 12, 2011 at 6:19 pm

          Well then that’s all I need to. No matter what I think of OWS I will believe these stats when a real and legitimate pollster does it.

        • 7 a night owl
          October 12, 2011 at 6:34 pm

          Where do you get the Matt Taibbi connection? The link goes to an October 2, 2011, NY Magazine article by a Tracey Samuelson, with no mention at all of Taibbi, who usually writes for Rolling Stone.

      • 8 utaustinliberal
        October 12, 2011 at 5:18 pm

        I don’t care about the randomness or non-randomness of the sample. The fact that out of 100 people, 55% didn’t vote in 2010 is DISGUSTNG! Not 1%, not 2%; 55%! Are you freaking kidding me? It is your CIVIC DUTY to vote. In some countries in Europe and the Middle East I believe, you can be fined for not voting and these whiners cavalierly disregearded their obligation. Now they want to moan and scream woe is me. Give me a break!

        • 9 Vicky
          October 12, 2011 at 5:38 pm

          About 60% of eligigle voters did not vote in 2010 if I recall correctly. From what I read above, the population interviewed for this article seems to fit the nonvoting demographic quite reasonably. I’m grateful they’re becoming engaged. It’s an important first step for them.

          • 10 PoliticalJunkessa
            October 12, 2011 at 6:25 pm

            Very true. Nothing is static.

          • 11 Jax6655
            October 12, 2011 at 6:27 pm

            Good point, Vicky, about the proportion of non-voters.

          • 12 EDP4BHO
            October 12, 2011 at 7:28 pm

            I wish I could share your enthusiasm.

          • 13 hopefruit2
            October 12, 2011 at 9:04 pm

            Vicky, it’s one thing if you don’t vote because you’re simply content or “fine” with the way things are and/or are just not engaged and couldn’t be bothered with politics one way or the other.

            It’s a completely different thing if you are highly demanding, scrutinizing and critical of a President or a political process, and then still fail to vote when you have an opportunity. This contradictory (yet harmful) behavior should not be excused or explained away. It is disgraceful, to put it mildly.

            • 14 nathkatun7
              October 12, 2011 at 11:33 pm

              Exactly, hopefruit! Look at the difference between this so called progressive movement and the right wing teabag movement. In just two years the teabaggers mobilized to take over congress and state governments in order to advance their agenda. Yet, many in this movement denigrate voting and continue to peddle lies that there is no difference between Republicans and Democrats. I guarantee you that if we don’t mobilize to defeat the teabaggers at the polls, what is happening in states like Wisconsin, Ohio, Michigan, Florida, Pennsylvania, would become a national trend. And, the fact that people occupied Wall Street would mean absolutely nothing when it comes to protecting the rights of workers, neutralizing corporate power and preserving safety nets for the poor and the elderly.

            • October 12, 2011 at 11:49 pm

              I have purposely just lurked here this week on TOD and other pragmatic blogs that I frequent. And up to this point, I have refrained from commenting on the OWS issue. Comments from individuals whom I’ve come to respect on TOD (like utaustinliberal, hopefruit2, sherjr, meta and many others) have been largely apprehensive about jumping on the OWS bandwagon. Comments from a few others whom I also respect have taken a more “wait and see” approach. At this stage of the game, I feel compelled to share my opinion–for whatever it’s worth.

              As a 100% Obama supporter, I am reluctant to embrace OWS—less from what I’ve seen of the protests and more from what I HAVEN’T seen. I HAVEN’T SEEN ANY support of President Obama or his efforts to move this country forward in spite of GOP and some Dem obstruction. I haven’t seen any real support of other democratic leaders or support of the agenda of the Democratic Party or the democratic process. I have seen any denouncements of any GOP leaders or presidential candidates who are willing to sacrifice the wellbeing of this country in order to defeat President Obama. I haven’t seen or heard of any type plan of action/philosophy/mission statement or any realistic goals espoused by these protestors who tell us they want to get rid of/change Wall Street/capitalism but don’t have any realistic solutions for replacing it or any solutions for improving the economic status of the majority of people in this country.

              What’s more, what I have seen I have NOT liked! I didn’t like seeing the video of the utter disrespect shown to Rep. John Lewis in Atlanta last weekend. I didn’t like seeing the willful arrogance and ignorance displayed by a few young protestors who have defied authority, lambasted democratic leaders, but who at the same time claim they are apolitical. I didn’t like seeing an almost homogenous group of protestors, largely white males under 30 years of age, who want to convince us that they represent 99% of the population—but at the same time, their own numbers do not display such representative demographic.

              But what I have DISLIKED the absolute MOST has been the audacity of individuals who’ve never or rarely posted comments here on TOD aggressively coming onboard TOD this week to underhandedly create discord and to chastise loyal TOD family members who are here at TOD because we want a refuge from the hate and negativity of all things associated with President Obama. Chipsticks has worked hard to create a safe haven for us here and I hate to see this haven weakened by a few who are basically disingenuous when it comes to their comments about OWS and its anti-Obama undercurrents.

              I am a 100 percent-er when it comes to President Obama! There is nothing OWS or anyone else can do to shake the confidence I have in POTUS who has proven the be the most honorable, accomplished, and progressive president in my lifetime. OWS’ agenda is not in sync with the President agenda’s; in fact, the underlying agenda of the protests appears to be against all things Obama. Until and unless I see some dramatic changes for the better with this “undefined” and “apolitical” group, I will NOT support OWS and its clandestine mission, and I will continue to work for the re-election President Obama — 100%.

          • 16 Puddin'
            October 12, 2011 at 11:10 pm

            IMO – People who don’t vote don’t have the right to complain…period!

          • October 15, 2011 at 11:43 am

            I”m not buying the “its an important first step” defense. Millions of people registered and voted for the first time in 2008 so ts not just about some figure stating 60% of eligible voters didn’t vote in 2010. 57% of eligible voters participated in 2008, yet 17% of that turned around and skipped the midterms, lowering total participation to 40%? And you’re making excuses for that?

        • 18 Uche
          October 12, 2011 at 5:51 pm

          UT….I have been silently perusing the diverse comments about the OWS movement on this site and have refrained from adding my voice because I was still not clear what their motives are and what they stand for. Certain statements I’ve heared coming out from them and the fact that they have remained silent in calling out the party that created the problems they’re protesting for, did tilt my sentiments towards their being mostly anti-Obama. This poll, regardless of the sampling size and procedure, just confirms what you, Hopefruit and many others here have been reiterating. You got them figured out early…and like you,I have nothing to do with them PERIOD!.

          • 19 EDP4BHO
            October 12, 2011 at 6:39 pm

            Well, isn’t this just dandy. I was on my way home to address just this topic after hearing on NPR one hippie saying she voted for PBO, but she found that he was “ill-prepared” to handle the job and now she’s looking for another Dem or Indy to run in 2012. Also, I heard some other hippie stating he would like more blacks to join the protest, as some blacks are beginning to do, and I include in the approval Rev Al Sharpton, Michael Baisden, and some local dj’s. Why, because they are not doing their homework. This should be a big slap in the face to all PBO supporters who jumped on that bandwagon prematurely. It was also discussed on Rev Al why more blacks are not linking with them. Now we see why…….these libruls have shown their true colors and that is why I called them hippies.

            • 20 SAB
              October 12, 2011 at 7:09 pm

              I didn’;t see Rev. Al’s show, what was it that he said why more AA’s were not joining. Just curious on his take.

              • 21 EDP4BHO
                October 12, 2011 at 7:27 pm

                It was on his radio broadcast. He insists we need to be involved. Love Rev Al but I’ve had my doubts and still do. Too much confusion and vagueness.

      • 22 PoliticalJunkessa
        October 12, 2011 at 5:26 pm

        I would be interested in the methodology as well. This seems like a “walk up to the man on the street poll.” More like a pop culture piece rather than a scientific poll. That said, I’m not a polling fan, as most here know. But I guess it provides a snapshot of the thinking of the 100 people interviewed.

        People will see what they want to see in it.

        • 23 PoliticalJunkessa
          October 12, 2011 at 5:39 pm

          If it was Matt Taibi that did the polling, and did it by walking up to people, then….. 🙄 . He’s quite the character. But again, people will see what they want to see.

          • 24 dotster3
            October 12, 2011 at 6:00 pm

            I have to say this poll seems a tad suspect. This group of 100 over here may have completely opposite opinions of that group of 100 over there, unless he was purposely wandering into different groups in different locations. And even then, you might not get a true picture, like when they pluck certain quotes for their stories to represent an opinion of a crowd. That person may be the only one with that opinion. It’s all hazy/dazy to me.

            • 25 dotster3
              October 12, 2011 at 6:02 pm

              And —you would likely get different responses in NY or DC than you’d get with demonstrators in Indy or Des Moines or South Bend or Tampa etc.

          • 26 Jax6655
            October 12, 2011 at 6:04 pm

            I write market research reports and analyze consumer data for a living. Disappointing results. Non-representative sample [100 out of thousands–half of them 20-29]. Non-scientific because he allows nulls (no answer) In real research, those results are thrown out.

            Conducted by Taibi, so the sample is even more suspect. You’re right with the eye-roll, PJ, he’s done some Obama-bashing in his day and he has been proven to fudge the facts to make his point. Plus, he didn’t break it down by race so he probably talked to all white people [not hating, just saying] pretty much just like him, except he has a job.

            Absolutely NO excuse for not voting. Period. But, I guess if they don’t vote, they’re not a threat.

            Oh, and nice, colorful graphics too!

            • October 12, 2011 at 6:19 pm

              I do love the graphic – and “borrowed” it – excellent discussion topic.

              And, btw, this is Vicky. I’m officially registered now – for now!!

            • 30 nathkatun7
              October 12, 2011 at 6:35 pm

              It seems to me that because the results are disappointing, and confirm what Hopefruit has been reporting, the only way for you to remain consistent in your glowing praise of OWS is to attack the results by questioning the process/methodology used to arrive at them.

              • 31 Jax6655
                October 12, 2011 at 6:56 pm

                You’ve seen no glowing praise from me. Giving someone the benefit of the doubt, believing that a few opportunists don’t speak for an entire movement, is hardly glowing praise. Any more than Ben Nelson or Mary Landrieu speak for all Democrats.

                And I have no love for folks who don’t vote, as I said above. It’s our duty as citizens to participate in our government. I was born PRIOR to the Voting Rights Act and remember that my parents couldn’t vote. I’ve voted in every election since I was 18 years old, local as well as national. Due to their age, most of these folks surveyed have probably only voted once, in 2008. Then they expected the world to change overnight and now they’re pissed. But, as many others have said here, they are only 100, in New York City, mostly the same age and mostly men (there are actually more women in the U.S. than men) and probably all white. So how could they possibly be representative?

                These results confirm only confirm the opinion of the 100 people (mostly 20-29) who participated in the survey. Not ‘attacking’ the research process just skeptical because, as I also said above, I’m a consumer data analyst and work with surveys for a living.

                Also Matt Taibi . . . .

                • 32 Jax6655
                  October 12, 2011 at 7:01 pm

                  The fact that he didn’t ask any questions about Republicans is a glaring omission! And slants the entire “survey” toward blaming PBO. Which was Taibi’s purpose in the first place.

                • 33 hopefruit2
                  October 12, 2011 at 9:27 pm

                  Jax6655, while it is true that the sampling methodology behind this survey is unknown and maybe nonscientific, I am willing to bet that an inexperienced pollster could haphazardly sample 100 TODers on this site and ask them the SAME questions as they did in this OWS poll and get a completely different result.

                  Do you really think that ONLY 1% of conveniently sampled TODers believe PBO is doing a good job?
                  Do you really think that 67% of conveniently sampled TODers never believed in PBO or are disappointed in him?
                  Do you really think that 55% of conveniently sampled TODers (who were eligible to vote) did not vote?
                  Do you really think that 75% of conveniently sampled TODers would self-identify as Naderites or say that the US Gov’t is on par with Al Qaeda?

                  Do you really think that a result like this could be probable on this site, assuming at least 100 people are conveniently sampled?

  2. 34 CTGirl
    October 12, 2011 at 4:47 pm

    55 didn’t vote! Someone should kick them in the ass! SMH! How can you not vote???

    • 35 a4alice
      October 12, 2011 at 4:57 pm

      Yep. That’s what really struck me is: did they vote in the midterm elections? majority said no. I’m gonna bet you all a soda in the pop machine at work that the majority of us here at TOD INCLUDING the lurkers voted in the midterm. And, although voicing your discontent with corporate greed and wallstreet is something that I applaud – still, – you didn’t vote? Comparing how legislation moved when Nancy P was Speaker as compared with Boehner that alone should say something about the consequences of not voting.

      Allright people that’s something to work with. I’m finished painting my porch – to the Twitterverse!

      • 36 utaustinliberal
        October 12, 2011 at 5:00 pm

        Me too Alice. I’m tweeting this. Who the heck doesn’t vote? Barring extreme exigent causes EVERYONE who is eligible to vote SHOULD vote. It’s your freaking civic duty. I bet if you polled more of the OWS people you’d find more morons who didn’t vote and now want to partake in bashing President Obama. Unfreaking believable.

      • 38 Vicky
        October 12, 2011 at 5:40 pm

        By participating here we pretty much self-identify as the minority interested in daily political issues.

    • 39 PoliticalJunkessa
      October 12, 2011 at 4:59 pm

      *putting my boots on for kickin*

      I truly do believe that the tea party sweep in 2010 was due to a very small, radicalized electorate that went to the polls while everybody else stayed home. Idiots! 👿

    • 40 tally
      October 12, 2011 at 5:25 pm

      If you don’t vote, you need to STFU.

      • 41 utaustinliberal
        October 12, 2011 at 5:26 pm

        My sentiments exactly Tally.

      • October 12, 2011 at 5:49 pm

        There’s way, way, way too much at stake these days to feel that cavalier about voting and then show up in the streets because you don’t support what’s happening in this country? They are either severely tuned out or just proud of their sense of anarchy. Either way, it doesn’t work to SOLVE PROBLEMS.

        • 43 Pickle48
          October 12, 2011 at 6:49 pm

          I sincereloy doubt, meta, that these individuals are being cavalier. We don’t know what they are. But I do think we should learn.

        • 44 elizabethtct@yahoo.com
          October 12, 2011 at 10:41 pm

          I have to say I really agree with this. Those that didn’t vote and are pissed off that no one is listening – well duh! The President SAID not to give them back the keys because they couldn’t drive and because they wanted/were going to drive us back into the ditch. And where are we? In the ditch. I have to say though I’ve seen this with other folks my age (late 20’s – early 30’s). All geared up in 2008 and have been basically taking a nap ever since. They wake up to parrot nonsense about the President not fighting hard enough blah blah blah. Honestly, a lot of people don’t grasp the fact that we need to VOTE in the people who are going to provide the President with offense, defense and cover. Paying attention for 2 – 3 months every four years is not going to cut it.

      • 46 Uche
        October 12, 2011 at 5:54 pm

        True word Tally.

      • 47 Puddin'
        October 12, 2011 at 11:34 pm

        That’s it, that’s all…period! I have voted since I was 18 (100 years ago) because it is my civic duty and I owe a whole lot of people who shedded blood, sweat and tears for my right to vote…I honor them every time I mark my ballot.

      • 48 JoJothecat
        October 12, 2011 at 11:53 pm

        Hey Tally,

        So true. I knew that these OWS were the first time voters who thought they could just sit out and not pay attention after voting in 2008. PBO telling them not to give the keys back, others like Ed Shultz and other telling them NOT to vote giving them an excuse to be lazy. CA got rid of anything GOP and as long as I live and breathe in this state I will campaign for DEMs.

    • 49 Sue
      October 12, 2011 at 9:53 pm

      Pretty crazy, not surprising, just crazy.

  3. 50 kittypat
    October 12, 2011 at 4:51 pm

    My motto is if you don’t vote then you can’t complain.

  4. 54 bonkers
    October 12, 2011 at 4:52 pm

    Cue Jax in 3…2…1…

    • 55 Bill
      October 12, 2011 at 5:16 pm

      If you believe everyone who has concerns about the direction of our country but does not agree with your method of expression is unworthy to express their opinion we are in for a long depressing campaign and probably future. You can wish to exclude them from the conversation to the country’s peril.

      • 56 utaustinliberal
        October 12, 2011 at 5:24 pm

        I’m sorry but there’s no way of positively spinning this. Nobody said anyone wasn’t worthy of expressing their opinions. But you don’t vote; you don’t get a voice. Simple as that. Don’t whine and moan and scream woe is me when PBO was practically begging their lazy butts to go VOTE! Unfreaking believable. Our country is in peril when morons who have the privilege of voting sit down and hand the keys to the country to radical teabaggers who want to roll back transformative legislation achieved by the most progressive President in history. Now they want us to get behind them when they couldn’t get behind MY President. Give me a break!

        • 57 Bill
          October 12, 2011 at 5:43 pm

          Do you have the ability to discuss political issues without calling the people you look down on “morons”? They may not have had the advantages you did to have developed your level of political sophistication. President Obama will never be heard caling someone a “moron”.

          • 58 utaustinliberal
            October 12, 2011 at 6:00 pm

            If you don’t vote and have the opportunity of doing so, then I’m sorry but you’re a moron. Especially when it was so crucial in 2010. It was inherently important for everyone eligible to go out and vote in 2010 to please do so. President Obama worked like a dog practically begging people to VOTE. Look at where we are now because teabaggers got handed back the keys. The economy is growing at an even slower pace, when we were adding an average of 200,000 jobs in 2010 under the Democrats. The debt ceiling brouhaha instigated by the teabaggers brought this country so close to her knees; made people on Medicare and Social Security absolutely terrified that they weren’t going to be receiving their benefits and for a lot of them; that’s their lifeline. It made the military have to worry about a paycheck when they’re out there committing the ultimate sacrifice for love of country. We have judicial nominees hanging in the balance due to teabagger politics. We have voter suppression tactics never before seen popping up in states with republican majority, we have OFA and President Obama fighting such a herculean battle for re-election. We have states challenging a healthcare law that so far has allowed one million young people to stay on their parents health insurance and have allowed 3.8 million women on Medicare to have a free mammogram in 2011. We have a financial reform law, the majority of which is still being implemented being defunded and rolled back by teabaggers. I could go on and on and on. All because morons didn’t go out to vote in 2010 in a blinkered attempt to stick it to President Obama.

            • October 12, 2011 at 6:26 pm

              There are many reasons people might not vote. If we attempt to understand such reasons better, we facilitate our democracy. As my Poppa used to say, you’ll catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

              • October 12, 2011 at 6:32 pm

                But my mother used to say “you can catch more files with honey than with vinegar. I don’t like flies.

                • 61 pickle48
                  October 12, 2011 at 6:52 pm

                  It’s a metaphor. Not meant to to be taken concretely.

                  I’m trying to get officially signed in. Now I’ve got at least four “names” on this thread! Oh, my…..

                  • October 12, 2011 at 7:29 pm

                    And my mother’s response was a metaphor as well. But the point that your metaphor was trying to make was somehow more valid than the point I and my mother were trying to make….Being nice does not always work. Sometimes blunt honesty is what is needed.

          • 63 Uche
            October 12, 2011 at 6:02 pm

            Bill, if someone has the ‘political sophistication’ to organize and be involved in a widespread protests of this kind but can’t get up and exercise a simple civic duty of casting a ballot, then I not only agree with utaustinliberal that they’re morons, I’ll go one up and call them cretins. When you voluntarily surrender your franchise and enable hucksters into positions of power and later come out to whine and complain,then your head need to be examined.

            • October 12, 2011 at 6:30 pm

              Political sophistication is not required to camp out and demonstrate. Courage, maybe. And anger probably. I wish I could interview them myself. I’d love the opportunity. And would dearly love to understand where those involved are coming from. I expect the responses would be quite individual.

              • 65 hopefruit2
                October 12, 2011 at 11:47 pm

                How much political sophistication does it take to simply register to vote and cast a ballot? We’re not asking them to run for congress or the senate!

          • 66 Puddin'
            October 12, 2011 at 11:41 pm

            Bill, imo there is no excuse for not voting…those people out must understand something about politics because they are there. But, if someone does’t understand who and what to vote for, they can asked somebody, become in engaged in the dialog. There are no excuses for not voting….period!

        • 67 maritza
          October 12, 2011 at 5:56 pm

          utaustinliberal yes, No Vote=Moran for the idiots that are able to vote and do not!

        • 68 TrumpDog
          October 12, 2011 at 6:02 pm

          Exactly, utaustinliberal!

      • 69 bonkers
        October 12, 2011 at 6:14 pm

        Uhhhh, what? I said nothing of the sort. In fact, I think the exact opposite of what you suggested.

        If you choose to make up sentences and falsely attribute them to others, you are in for a long, difficult future. Just offering some friendly advice.

      • 70 nathkatun7
        October 12, 2011 at 7:01 pm

        Any one who is concerned with “the direction of our country” must also be concerned with learning how the political system works. Any one qualified to vote should understand that protest alone does not bring about changes we want. These people sat on their behinds and handed the Congress to teabaggers. I am sorry, but I can’t take people who don’t vote, or who think that there is no difference between Democrats and Republicans, seriously. While they are out there spending all their energy on occupying wall street, the teabaggers are out registering and mobilizing people to vote for right wing Republicans, in 2012, to completely take over the two houses of Congress and the Presidency. Guess what, once the teabaggers take over their mission is to take the country back to the 19th century’ and probably even further than that. There are teabag/right wing voices who are increasingly calling for restricting the right to vote to only those who have jobs and pay federal income taxes.

        • 71 utaustinliberal
          October 12, 2011 at 7:15 pm

          Once again, Nath you come through. Brilliantly stated. Thanks for the historical FACTUAL perspective. 🙂

          • 72 nathkatun7
            October 13, 2011 at 12:16 am

            Thanks UT for your kind words. I truly value your opinions. You see, like you, I am just fed up with people who try to diminish the importance of voting and then hope to bring about change. Yes, there is a role for protests and demonstrations and petitioning, but all these must always be accompanied by political mobilization to vote for people who pass laws to advance your interests. Otherwise, protests and demonstrations become an end in themselves, with nothing to show, when it comes to changing policies or changing laws.

  5. 73 utaustinliberal
    October 12, 2011 at 4:55 pm

    Unfreaking believable. This is what I mean about the chaos and confusion that reigns when a group doesn’t have a concrete message. Seriously. They didn’t know what the Volcker rule was and that President Obama helped to enact it. Yet they protest Wall Street greed and lack of consumer protections. A majority of them didn’t vote in 2010. If one has the privilege of voting and doesn’t vote – except due to exigent causes – then one should STFU and quit whining and groaning. You don’t vote and now you want to bitch about Wall Street greed and bad government? Who the f*ck allowed corrupt teabaggers to gain power and now begin rolling back or trying to defund transformative regulations put in place by President Obama to protect the lazy asses of the OWS protesters. You don’t vote and the majority of you OWS identify with Nader and say PBO disappointed you. Take the look into the freaking mirror and find out that YOU disappointed him, He practically begged your lazy asses to get to the voting booth in 2010 and not give the keys back to the ones who destroyed the economy; yet you OWS people stayed home and now want to point fingers at PBO? Screw you. I bet there are many more OWS people like the 100 they polled who didn’t go out to vote. You don’t vote; you don’t get a voice. Simple as that. They would fix Wall Street with a President Elizabeth Warren. Are you kidding me? They don’t even have concrete viable solutions to solve the problem and they’re bitching at the one person (PBO) who can curb Wall Street overreach in its tracks. The fact that they see the OWS movement as a success so far shows how politically and historically naive they are. Who the heck doesn’t vote when they have that opportunity. Saudi Arabian women were practically dying for the opportunity to vote and these nitwits didn’t go out to vote. Now they want to cry over spilt milk. Cry me a freaking river!

    • 74 theo67
      October 12, 2011 at 5:01 pm

      OMG – everything you said is what I was thinking, UT. They would let down their fictitious “President Elizabeth Warren” exactly the same way they’ve let down the real President Obama. They are completely clueless – the fact that they didn’t know the answer to the Volker Rule question explains why they’ve been occupying Wall Street for four weeks without a coherent message. They are protesting their feelings of angst, without a clear understanding of the source of their angst or the path to resolving the problems. They probably don’t even get that Wall Street isn’t really the source of their problems – it’s Goldman Sachs!

      They caused this mess by not voting. They perpetuate the mess by fixating on President Obama – the only person who’s actually working to make things better. And if you were to ask them if they made a single phone call for the American Jobs Act, well, they’d probably tell you that they are glad it was voted down – without knowing the first thing in the bill.

      This poll made me furious.

      • 75 gcwp1
        October 12, 2011 at 5:06 pm

        Everything UT and Theo said is what I have been thinking. This poll made me spit bullets.

        • 76 TrumpDog
          October 12, 2011 at 6:03 pm

          Me too.

          Did you vote in the 2010 midterm elections?

          Yes: 39
          No: 55


          • 77 gcwp1
            October 12, 2011 at 6:08 pm

            This is the angriest I’ve been in a while – and I’m not the angry type! What REAL movements have accomplished in the past to give all persons the right to vote, what many servicepeople believe they are protecting, what the OFA does day after day…basta, breathe….

      • 78 ChristiMtl
        October 12, 2011 at 5:13 pm

        What UT and Theo67 said…………I can’t believe this, 55 of them didn’t vote……….

        • 79 Debz
          October 12, 2011 at 5:23 pm

          Excellent comments UT and Theo67. These people who didn’t vote in 2010 probably didn’t vote in ’08 either. The OWS people didn’t like the fact that some people wanted to register voters, now we know why. They don’t understand the concept of voting in a democracy, especially in our form of government where votes can make a difference between Nancy P and the orange fool who is afraid of the tea party. They really think someone like Elizabeth Warren would destroy the banks, letting the economy get worse, letting more people lose their jobs? Idiots!!

          • 80 Janelle
            October 12, 2011 at 5:33 pm

            I for one think that Elizabeth Warren is a formidable candidate and I like her a heck of a lot, but she is for strong regulation–she would never get rid of the banks/corporations or not want them to be profitable. This group surveyed would be dissappointed with President Warren before she was sworn in, not to mention the first 6 months of her term….especially if she hired even one person that formally served in the Obama administration. She would be deemed a sellout in doing so. I am still for peaceful protest, and that is their right. But no organization is more disciplined and action-oriented than OFA right now. The President is really trying to build an infrastructure of activism that is hard to duplicate.

            • 81 Janelle
              October 12, 2011 at 5:50 pm

              P.S. I know that OWS in different cities have diverse and varied makeup and this was not a scientific poll so my comments are referenced to the 55 people only mentioned in this survey that I am dissappointed with their opinions.

          • 82 theo67
            October 12, 2011 at 5:34 pm

            The fact that so many are endowing Elizabeth Warren with superpowers has been bothering me for a while. This is the same expectation-setting that they did to President Obama. Elizabeth Warren is running for one seat in the Senate, and she’ll only get one vote. She’s not going to be able to do anything radical there on her own, and if people aren’t going to vote,then the chances of having more progressive Senators and Congresspeople (because bills have to pass both houses to become law) are pretty slim. If these people don’t understand how government works, how voting works, how things actually become real and tangible, then there’s no point in Elizabeth running and she should try and make change from the private sector, where she’ll have more chance at making a difference.

            If people educated themselves on the civic process, and then worked to make that more effective, then we’d see real change. Instead, there’s this fantasy world that keeps popping up where people look for a superhero, and then get disappointed when the superhero turns out to be human, after all.

            • 83 jacquelineoboomer
              October 12, 2011 at 8:58 pm


              Now, Theo67, if I could just fit all of that in a tweet, I’d send it to Rock and ask him to RT it to his 20,000 followers. Or maybe you have 20K. 🙂

      • 84 tally
        October 12, 2011 at 5:26 pm

        If these people love Ms Warren then they need to LISTEN TO HER LOVE FOR PBO!!!

        • 85 COS
          October 12, 2011 at 5:37 pm

          They should also realize that PBO asked Ms. Warren to set up the CPA; it was his idea. The poll about voting in the 2010 election, confirms exactly what I was thinking.

        • October 12, 2011 at 6:24 pm

          99.99% of these people wouldn’t know her name if Pres.Obama didn’t pick her to be on his team. Warren has said herself numerous times that there would be no consumer agency if it weren’t for him and that he never waivered on it.

          I find it curious that Warren’s words are never attributed to Pres. Obama but every shit, spit and bubble out of Geithner is.

      • 87 prettyfoot58
        October 12, 2011 at 6:00 pm

        but look at the age range..majority (20-29)….very young…

        the pollster did not ask if they were students or employed….curious that he didn’t…

        • 88 PoliticalJunkessa
          October 12, 2011 at 6:47 pm

          40% of 20-29 year olds may actually be *higher* than the average percentage of voters in that age group. It may even be higher than the percentage of people among *all* age groups that vote in mid-term elections.

        • 89 Jennifer
          October 12, 2011 at 6:48 pm

          True, are any of them working? Going to school? Since this VERY unscientific poll was taken, I’d like to see a reputable poll taken by maybe 2-3 firms (as they seem to vary quite a bit) . Damn, why is the US seemingly so blase about voting? How many people around the world line up for miles in order to vote?

          Dating myself here, but the voting age in California was 21 back when I could first vote. I’m proud to say that I’ve never missed even ONE vote, including city elections. I couldn’t wait! I already was married with a 3 year old daughter and was going through the Vietnam era. I (and my husband) really tried to instill in her the value of voting. I’m on disability now, but am able to vote absentee – I study those election tomes you get in the mail with a fine tooth comb. If I don’t know what a certain proposition is about or need some clarification, I do research.

          I wonder about some of these kid’s parents? Bet you anything voting isn’t big in their households. My folks might have been Republican (establishment ones back in the day), but they never let me forget my civic duty. Granted, my dad, was a bit disappointed that I somehow turned out so liberal, but he was proud of me nevertheless for having convictions.

          • 90 pickle48
            October 12, 2011 at 6:56 pm

            The plutocrats of our society seem very satisfied with the majority of citizens being blase about voting. With their most recent attacks on public education, they seem to be trying to facilitate such an attitude.

    • 91 Bill
      October 12, 2011 at 5:36 pm

      If you believe people who do not have your knowledge, who do not have concrete solutions to our complex problems, who do not express themselves in the manner you require, and do not have stellar voting records are contemptible there will be few swing voters for President Obama. A little humility and understanding go a long way. An elitist view one one’s political acumen does not persuade people.

      • 92 utaustinliberal
        October 12, 2011 at 5:45 pm

        You have the privilege of voting and you don’t use it, then YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO WHINE, MOAN, AND COMPLAIN. There is no way to positively spin this Bill. So please save yourself the time. This is not an elitist view. This is every citizens view. A lot of swing voters vote in every election. That’s why they’re called SWING VOTERS; because they swing elections in favor of Democrats or Republicans but Dems and Repubs still heavily rely on their base to come out and vote! vote! vote!. If an OWS person was eligible to vote and had no extreme circumstance barring him/her getting off his/her lazy ass to go to the voting booth and vote, then as Tally so sweetly put it: STFU. How about they go #OccupyAVotingBooth or better yet #OccupyCongress. The nerve of people not voting. Unfreaking believeable.

        • 93 Bill
          October 12, 2011 at 6:00 pm

          I do not understand what “unfreaking believable” means, except the only other person I have heard use it is the half term governor, but you seem very angry and a bit self righteous.

          • 94 utaustinliberal
            October 12, 2011 at 6:06 pm

            Once again Bill, you don’t vote; you don’t get a voice. No matter who you want to compare me to, to be able to pat yourself on the back it’s your freaking business. You CANNOT positively spin this. 55% of them didn’t go out to vote and this is who you were chastising me for not jumping on the bandwagon? Give yourself a pat on the back. 🙄

            • 95 libbyjagessar
              October 12, 2011 at 10:51 pm

              Well 8 out of 8 people I know who have participated in OWS did vote. And are huge supporters of the President. So of the people I actually know that’s 100%. *Shrugs* This is 55% of 100 people. I’m sorry but I just don’t think we can put everyone down there expressing their anger in this group. However, for those in this poll that did not vote and are pissed off well they have no leg to stand on. Really. None.

          • 96 TrumpDog
            October 12, 2011 at 6:10 pm

            It’s an expression to convey how you can’t fathom what was said because it’s so far out there.
            And she’s right; you bitch but had the chance to vote to help shape what’s going on and chose not to.

            • 97 EDP4BHO
              October 12, 2011 at 6:58 pm

              I’m with utaustin. Bill, I see you’re still trying to change minds, but you say you don’t support the OWs. You seem to be the argumentive one on this site today, yet chastising others.

          • 98 FiredUpInCA
            October 12, 2011 at 7:32 pm

            Utaustinliberal is not self-righteous. Utaustinliberal is just right. If you don’t vote, you have unilaterally disarmed and so you are moron. The only substantial weapon that you have to thwart the 1 percenters, the Koch brothers, tea partiers and rogue Wall Streeters is your vote. You don’t use it. You lose. Too bad, too sad, too dumb. Wake up and smell the Wisconsin.

            Bill stop making excuses for an able-bodied young person who has the mental and motor skills to sit-in at a protest, not using those same mental and motor skills to walk into a voting booth or send in an absentee ballot from their home during the midterms. They had the power to help outnumber the regressive tea partiers during the midterms and they screwed up. What the hell were they doing that was so important on that one day out of the year. Yet now their schedules are free to occupy Wall Street. Moronic strategy is moronic.

      • 99 gcwp1
        October 12, 2011 at 5:52 pm

        That is absurd. I voted as soon as I was legal. My almost ninety year old mother, hobbles to the polls. If the Reps weren’t so GOOD at voting, they wouldn’t have monopoplized the system.

        Polls are in your NEIGHBORHOOD. There are RIDES to them.

        The people who canvass, who go door to door (hi KP) for OFA are not elitist. The people on this blog are not elitist. Nonsense.

    • 103 nathkatun7
      October 13, 2011 at 12:23 am

      Absolutely spot-on, UT! You totally nailed it.

  6. 104 prettyfoot58
    October 12, 2011 at 4:57 pm

    Lumpenproletariat (definition from Wikipedia)

    a collective term from Lumpenproletarier (a German word literally meaning “raggedy proletarian”), was first defined by Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels in The German Ideology (1845) and later elaborated on in other works by Marx. The term was originally coined by Marx to describe that layer of the working class, unlikely to ever achieve class consciousness, lost to socially useful production, and therefore of no use in revolutionary struggle or an actual impediment to the realization of a classless society[1]

    Interesting….i wonder where will this all lead…

    • 105 Vicky
      October 12, 2011 at 5:47 pm

      The concepts of false and class consciousness were important contributions toward understanding political and economic realities. It is challenging to break through false consciousness in a society dominated by a profit-based corporate media oligopoly. These protesting individuals appear to be making that break-through. I am excited by the prospect!

  7. 106 gcwp1
    October 12, 2011 at 5:05 pm

    That’s it, Baby. That is it. I’m not a wonk, but I trust my instincts. I, and others who agreed with me, KNEW this.

    TPV,a fantastic blog, was locked in polite battle over the question of the ligitimacy of this movement.

    Protestors – take a polygraph. Are you getting off on this, or do you believe it will help create jobs? Seriously!

    It is one step above the laziness factor of blogging. Call it Street Performance Blogging.

    OK, now I’M wasting time. Reading about voter suppression the other day, I had an idea. Does anyone know if there are state/town/country volunteer efforts to combat this, and how can one get involved? I was thinking of the League of Women Voters here?

    • 107 globalcitizenlinda
      October 12, 2011 at 5:21 pm

      Ohio needs a lot of help right now since it is the process of collecting signature to overturn the new restrictions placed into law by koch-brothers-owned kasich. call and promote others to call who have friends and relatives in Ohio

      • 109 nathkatun7
        October 13, 2011 at 12:32 am

        I actually think they’ve gathered enough signatures to put this new voter restriction on the ballot. I may be wrong, but I think the signatures are awaiting certification so that the measure to overturn this law will be placed on the ballot for the Nov. elections. What is needed is to support Ohioans in their drive to mobilize voters to show up and vote in November to overturn this obnoxious law.

  8. October 12, 2011 at 5:06 pm

    Ralph Nader huh? That tells us all why nobody wants to identify a spokesman!
    They dont really have any numbers and they need quantity…

  9. October 12, 2011 at 5:07 pm

    heh interesting how 75 of 100 were either Nader or Chomskey… and yet 40 of the 100 say they believed in “Obama”, but he let them down… methinks they’re not being honest.

  10. October 12, 2011 at 5:09 pm

    Amen…Amen UTA, you couldn’t have said it better. Thank you:-)

    Like I told Van Jones…You fell asleep, while PBO was trying to pass Health Care, You stood by and let Teaparty Takeover…
    You stood silent while PBO had to do all the work……We then had the P/L, Ed Shultz telling people Not to vote so that they could teach him a lesson…

    The damage was done when you allowed Congress to fall in the hand of TeaParty/Republicans..we know we have to double the effort in working harder to prevent new laws from happening: Voting Rights, Woman Right, Social Issues, Economy, and so on…
    So how is that working out for ya???


  11. October 12, 2011 at 5:17 pm

    I tweeted the following just the other day:

    Maybe if they had occupied a voting booth in 2010, there would have been no need to #ows in 2011.
    8 Oct

    Well looks like I was correct in my assumption,

  12. October 12, 2011 at 5:20 pm

    GEEZE. Not an impressive group by any stretch. Mostly young men and the vast majority seem to not know how the country works and thinks Ralph Nadar is the solution? Unbelievably absurd and naive.

  13. 124 Vicky
    October 12, 2011 at 5:21 pm

    I read the article but could find no reference to their sampling procedure. Without knowing that I cannot assume any more validity or reliability than a text-in vote to the O’Reilly or Ed Show. Please let us know, Fred, if you find that information. Also, it would be helpful to find demographic differences between those who are able to stay on-site and those who are not. I’m participating in one in Wisconsin this week-end. Thus far it appears we’re going to be primarily in our 30’s to 70’s. A lot of professors (probably the most represented profession), but I won’t know until it happens. I’m one of those fact-based people who are so reviled at the present time! LOL! I would think reputable polling will occur in the future, but researching such a diverse group would pose significant challenges.

  14. 128 kittypat
    October 12, 2011 at 5:27 pm

    OK here’s a rhetorical question about the Nader factor, if some of these “occupiers” are truly supportive of Nader then why does he get a pass for acquiring his fortune through the stock market/Wall Street? I already know that he lives frugally, but so what? If this all fell down around our ears what skin would he have in the game?

    • 129 nathkatun7
      October 13, 2011 at 12:46 am

      Hi Kittypat, how big is Nader’s fortune? Is he a millionaire? Sorry for sounding so ignorant but I was not aware that Nadar is a rich man.

  15. October 12, 2011 at 5:27 pm

    Whoa! That girl from the Huffington post just hammered Mittens, on Hardball.
    If you got that video…

    • 131 Debz
      October 12, 2011 at 5:32 pm

      Until someone “hammers” him to his face it wont matter. He has done so much lying about PBO and no one calls him on it. No one is going to pay attention to a talking head on Tweety’s show.

  16. October 12, 2011 at 5:28 pm

    Please don’t put to much stock in these polls. This isn’t the entire country they’re polling, it’s 100 people. People didn’t vote in Nov of 2010 that’s why we ended up with the teabaggers in DC. Our message should be “GET OUT AND VOTE.” If they don’t, I better get that kiss to go along with that *bleep!!.

  17. 137 PoliticalJunkessa
    October 12, 2011 at 5:31 pm

    LMAO@ the 4% “Other” under Gender. Those wacky kids :mrgreen: !

  18. 139 meabloom
    October 12, 2011 at 5:48 pm

    How can you grumble, whine, and complain when you didn’t even vote for change. Now you want change so you protest. What should happen is the 29% who did vote should turn and protest the 55% who didn’t.
    To be honest, I really don’t care too much about the polls. They ask a few people and take that and run when those few don’t make up the the whole body of America.
    I am truly what my my mother has been calling me since 2009:: An ObamaBrat!


  19. October 12, 2011 at 5:52 pm

    If they don’t vote, then they will have no impact on 2012 and any time thereafter. So, for all intents and purposes, they’re irrelevant. If they’re not going to be a force for anything positive, we waste our time thinking about them. We have too many battles to fight to keep elections reasonably fair; we don’t need any more distractions or sources of outrage. Inchoate rage and whining never changed a single meaningful thing. They’ve had some time now to come up with a purpose and it’s still zilch. Personally, I’m going to spend my time getting people registered and informed.

    • 144 theo67
      October 12, 2011 at 6:11 pm

      Very good advice. A lot of wasted energy if they don’t have a focus or tangible goals – and irrelevant in the greater scheme of things. Especially in an election year and when people need action on jobs and the economy. If they were really worried about Wall Street and corruption,then they’d be demanding that Cordray be affirmed and the components of the Dodd-Frank bill be enacted. I haven’t heard anything about that from anyone representing them.

  20. October 12, 2011 at 5:53 pm

    New Hampshire’s secretary of state warned Wednesday that he could set a primary date as early as Dec. 6 unless Nevada moves back the date of its caucuses.

  21. 147 globalcitizenlinda
    October 12, 2011 at 5:57 pm

    I do not know if my concern is true: but is there a danger in promoting this poll of 100 people?

    why? because the rightwingers and media could use this to push the message that Democrats and liberals are no longer supportive of PBO because “he has disappointed them”? you know they love this point contrary to the actual numbers?

    it could also be a way to push back on any kind of activism on the important issue of social justice

    • 148 PoliticalJunkessa
      October 12, 2011 at 6:03 pm

      Well, that’s the danger of jumping on a poll as if it presents the whole, complete truth. It can be spinned, unfortunately.

    • 150 theo67
      October 12, 2011 at 6:14 pm

      The poll specifically says that the majority of respondents are Naderites. I’m not convinced that the OWS people are Democrats. And the media is already painting their picture of disappointment among Democrats – not sure reality will make any difference to their stories.

    • 154 nathkatun7
      October 13, 2011 at 1:10 am

      I don’t see any danger of exposing the fact the OWS movement is primarily dominated by supporters of Ralph Nader and by people who do not vote. Right wingers and the MSM don’t need this to push negative message about PBO. They do that all the time. They do that even when the evidence contradicts their Obama bashing message. What this poll does is to dissuade the majority of Democrats from embracing a movement that is aimed at undermining the Democratic party. I am sorry, but I am suspicious about the timing of this movement. Just when President Obama was trying to mobilize the country to support a significant Jobs bill, all of a sudden we have this OWS movement, which, so far as I know, has done absolutely nothing to put pressure on Congress to pass the jobs bill.

  22. 155 Ladyhawke
    October 12, 2011 at 6:00 pm

    Here’s some recommended reading for the protesters……



    • 156 EDP4BHO
      October 12, 2011 at 8:11 pm

      Thanks Ladyhawke. I seriously am going to use this to try and persuade the non-voters and other apathetic folks I’m sure to come across come 2012, and give them a lesson they maybe have not taken the time to learn.

  23. 157 PoliticalJunkessa
    October 12, 2011 at 6:01 pm

    I wonder why the “pollster” didn’t ask what the protesters thought of republicans — either a republican in particular (like Eric Cantor, Peter King, Herman Cain who have all denigrated them) or republican/conservative thought in general.

    Hmmmmm. 🙄

  24. 162 jeff
    October 12, 2011 at 6:05 pm

    Umm how can anyone claim that Obama let them down when they didn’t vote?

    Oh and btw 100 people isn’t nearly enough to get an actual sample so this isn’t a valid poll.

    • 163 theo67
      October 12, 2011 at 6:25 pm

      I think you’ll find that a lot of people are rooting for a grassroots movement to succeed – especially if it’s calling out corruption and GOP obstruction and looking for a way to put the country back on track. But, the desire for a group to shout and rail against the powers that be will not achieve much if there’s no clear direction or mission. And that’s why the message is garbled – because so many disparate causes are glomming on to OWS – trying to shape it into what they’re looking for. In an election year, that is a dangerous combination, because it’s bound to lead to disappointment when no practical steps are being taken to bring about the change people are seeking. And when the only people who are speaking for the movement are libertarians or professional left spokespeople like Dylan Ratigan – then the movement will be hijacked to further the agenda of a few.

      A real and dedicated grassroots group already exists in OFA.They have diligently worked to pass legislation, influence public opinion and support the President. They are registering people to vote, and working to overcome Republican attempts to steal the election. They’ve been communicating successes, supporting the President and educating voters. If people really want to make a difference in 2012, then why are they not joining OFA? OFA is just as angry as the next guy, but they’re channeling their anger into action – coordinated action with a tangible goal. Re-elect President Obama and get the country moving again.

      If OWS doesn’t sort itself out, then the opinions of these 100 people is all people will know about the movement. And that’s a wasted opportunity to mobilize people for change.

  25. October 12, 2011 at 6:14 pm

    Why, oh why are we at all concerned over a tiny unscientific poll by a suspect pollster. Guess we need to keep reminding ourselves about the worthlessness of polls.

  26. 165 a night owl
    October 12, 2011 at 6:19 pm

    Obviously it’s not a scientific poll. It’s more like an informal survey, which can nevertheless be telling. 55% not voting is absolutely shameful for political “activists.” I would be ashamed to admit it if I were in their shoes, because if politicians think you can’t be bothered to vote, why should they care what you have to say? Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. This particular group is definitely not representative of me or my views, and I happen to be a part of the 99%.

  27. October 12, 2011 at 6:24 pm

    Vice President Biden suggested Wednesday that President Obama’s jobs bill will help keep murder and rape rates down because it will fund public safety officers.

    “If anyone listening doubts whether or not there is a direct correlation between the reduction in cops and firefighters and the rise in concerns of public safety, they need look no further than your city, Mr. Mayor,” Biden said at an appearance to tout the American Jobs Act at a firehouse in Flint, Mich.

    Biden said that while some voters tell him cities don’t need more police officers and firefighters — which the jobs bill would fund — he believes it’s essential to bulk up public safety forces to keep crime rates down.

    “In 2008, when Flint had 265 sworn officers on the police force, there were 35 murders and 91 rapes in this city. In 2010, when Flint had only 144 police officers, the murder rate climbed to 65 and rapes — just to pick two categories — climbed to 229. In 2011, you now have only 125 shields,” he said.

    “God only knows what the numbers will be this year for Flint if we don’t rectify it,” he said — the jobs bill would be a key way to do so. “And God only knows what that number would have been had we not been able to get a little bit of help to you.”

    Pool report-

    • 167 theo67
      October 12, 2011 at 6:31 pm

      People may not like to hear these words from VP Biden, but these are facts. All I’ve heard these past few days from the GOP and their blind followers is “why would we do another stimulus when the first one didn’t work”. Well, it did work. And there’s plenty of evidence to confirm that. I also see Romney saying “permanent tax cuts are the only way to go”- well, where do you get the money for permanent tax cuts, unless you do permanent service cuts, too? And who will get those permanent tax cuts – will it be the middle class, or the rich?

      The GOP seem to have decided that the only facts they care about are the ones they make up. So, there’s no real way to argue with them. People will need to decide whether they believe their own eyes – look at job creation before the GOP took over and after. Look at who has tried to protect workers and who hasn’t. Look at what Romney has done for a living, versus what President Obama has done for a living – and decide which one you think is actually going to look after the interests of working people.

    • October 12, 2011 at 6:48 pm

      VP Biden is right to suggest hiring more police officers. I earned my BS in Sociology. Research shows that crime rates increase during stressful economic times, and we’re currently experiencing one of those times.

  28. October 12, 2011 at 6:27 pm

    I know many of us are skeptical of OWS but I don’t trust this poll at all. Matt Taibbi? Nah. Pass.

  29. 170 PoliticalJunkessa
    October 12, 2011 at 6:34 pm

    Well, that’s the thing. They never said they were *political* activists. I don’t know about the 100 polled, but there are plenty of people in this country who are turned off by the whole political process. The majority of people don’t vote in mid-term or local elections. Voting is crucially important. It’s sacred to me. 100 out of 100 polled “should” have been voters — in *my* opinion. However, it’s not the ONLY way in America to express one’s views. Also — if the “pollster’s” sample is made up of predominantly 20-29 year olds, then it’s no wonder he didn’t get enough voters — that age group is famously hard to get to the ballot box, especially in midterms.

    • 171 PoliticalJunkessa
      October 12, 2011 at 6:37 pm

      Oops, should have been a response to a post upthread talking about political activists… 😳

      • 172 a night owl
        October 12, 2011 at 7:07 pm

        Whether or not they call themselves political activists, if they aspire to take action to change things, they are activists, and if they want their actions to change things in the context of a democracy, their activism must be political (i.e., it must ultimately involve voting; what is the alternative? Burn it down? That’s DEFINITELY not a movement I can get behind). I’ll say it again: if they don’t vote, they shouldn’t expect to be taken seriously.

        • 173 Vicky
          October 12, 2011 at 7:25 pm

          It is political. It may not be partisan, but that is something different.

          • 174 FiredUpInCA
            October 12, 2011 at 8:27 pm

            Well then what is the endgame? To just get attention? To just raise awareness? Why should they be taken seriously if they don’t plan to translate this attention-getting, and frustration-airing into anything but protracted attention-getting and frustration-airing?

            ORGANIZING for America > OCCUPY Wall Street. Oraganzing suggests a plan to get up and do something. Occupying? What is that? What’s next? What’s the endgame?

          • 175 nathkatun7
            October 13, 2011 at 2:08 am

            So, Vicky, how does a non partisan, non-voting movement help us when the teabag-Republicans are busy mobilizing their voters to vote to control all branches of the federal government, as well as all the State and local governments, throughout the country? I have no issue with political activism and emphasis on protest and demonstrations. What I have an issue with is the belief that you can be a non-voting, and non-partisan activist when the other side contesting power is very partisan and is highly mobilized to vote. Do you really think that a Republican government that controls Congress and the Presidency will be bothered by a bunch of people camping out in the park next to Wall Street? I am sorry, but I think people are naive if they think what happened at Tahrir Square in Egypt, a country ruled by a U.S. dependent dictator for over thirty years, can be replicated by the OWS movement. The people in Tahrir Square were contesting power; the OWS movement is, IMHO, not contesting power; instead, it’s simply expressing righteous anger. The two are not the same.

  30. October 12, 2011 at 6:46 pm

    We live in an extremely toxic political environment. The OWS is a symptom of that, a kind of general free-floating malaise. But if people don’t recognize the importance of voting after everything we’ve been through in the last year – unnecessary right-wing extremist crisis after crisis and threats to shut down government, repeal health care, eliminate right to choose – then we are in a very precarious and dangerous predicament. Because while people are standing on street corners trying to coalesce and fight the conventional two-party system, the asses in the GOP are pulling stunt after stunt to destroy our democracy.

    • 177 theo67
      October 12, 2011 at 7:15 pm

      This is so true. There’s an urgency in this situation,because the election is a year away. In that time, there’s a lot of damage that’s going to be done, and there area lot of people who will go without the help that they need. Instead of inventing a plethora of causes to be disgruntled about, these OWS people could be coalescing around the causes that have already been identified and which need defending – right now! By the time the OWS people figure out who they are, what they’re angry about and how to organize themselves to get stuff done, it may be too late to do anything.

      Those people who support the OWS movement – by all means,support people on the streets calling for change – but also convince them to do something! Pick up the phone, call their congress people, register people to vote, help them get a clear message of intent. But, letting them just drift from day to day, singing and chanting with no specific purpose – it’s putting everything at risk.

  31. 182 globalcitizenlinda
    October 12, 2011 at 6:46 pm

    What I intend to do from now on is to observe what OWS people are doing and listen to what they are saying.

    if I personally come across any member who needs a little bit of information to clarify their position, then I wil offer my suggestion and indicate my sources.

    time will tease out the truth and show actual agendas and path foward.

    if I get into a situation where i can harness some of the OWS members activism energy and vote to support President Obama’s re-election, then believe me I will make sure I guide it calmly to my O-cause

    • 183 a4alice
      October 12, 2011 at 8:18 pm

      I confess that when I first read this thing I got so instantly ticked off that I flew out to Twitter and wrote a couple of snarky things to #OWS and then tweeted that young man LaGreca to look at this thing and the importance of voting. And then when I got all done being a snark I thought that’s the problem with Twitter. If you are ticked you can be snarky and mean and not constructive. Global, I like what you have said here. I think that is what I will do too. I realize that I have a part of me that has no patience for people that don’t vote. However. I have to remember that this was 100 people. That’s not very many, BUT may be casually representative.

      And like Theo67 says above:

      “but also convince them to do something! Pick up the phone, call their congress people, register people to vote, help them get a clear message of intent.”

      I am going to try to do what little I can to tell these people 1. Voting is important (and if people had voted we’d be in a more constructive place) 2. Voting for Obama is important ( if he doesn’t get in 2012 all the work he’s done so far will be for naught)

      Allright. But. People. Should. Vote.

  32. 184 desertflower
    October 12, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    I didn’t read all the comments, but I saw all I needed to see with this “poll”…most of the protesters are in their 20’s….which means they have voted, or had the opportunity to vote in only 3 Presidential elections…considering that Bush was in for 8 years…that doesn’t leave much. The fact that MORE than a majority DIDN’T vote in the midterms is ALL the info I need. They wanted the magic wand to wash away all the bad from Bush, and never gave PBO the Dems he needed in the midterms to keep the momentum going, giving him the ability he needed to get more progressive legislation through…stuff they wanted, we all wanted, but it was THEIR PISSY IN ACTION that enabled the nutjobs to have any say at all and paralyze our country! THEY DIDN”T DO THEIR CIVIC DUTY, NOW THEY’RE PISSED? TFB! They evidently didn’t pay attention in govt class, when they were explaining how govt works! I put this fiasco squarely on their shoulders….if you DON’T VOTE>>YOU DON’T GET TO BITCH. He told them not to give the keys back….was that selective hearing???? They chose to ignore the warning because they didn’t get the FLYING MAGIC PONY! I could go on, but I need to get my daughter from work….back later. Maybe someone feels like I do:)

    • 185 utaustinliberal
      October 12, 2011 at 7:21 pm

      Absolutely true desertflower. “You don’t vote; you don’t get to bitch.” Righteous rant. Absolutely spot on.

      • 186 desertflower
        October 12, 2011 at 7:41 pm

        Thank you,ut….had to get that off my chest:) It bothers me that they thought when they voted in 2008, they thought they were DONE with their responsibility.How absolutely ridiculous and sad. I really hate pissing and moaning.

        • 187 Walking_on_ Sunshine
          October 12, 2011 at 10:06 pm

          A lot of people do skip the midterms. A young member of my own family did. When I found out, the young man got a lecture. I think a lot of young people just don’t think things through to their logical conclusions. This well meaning young person is not allowed to bitch to me again until he has voted in 2012. Then he will get reminder calls in 2014. We need to focus on drilling in this message. Did you vote? Why not? The one question I don’t see on this poll is what these young people think of the #GOP.

    • 188 Vicky
      October 12, 2011 at 7:27 pm

      It’s a bit similar to the situation of “getting religion” (“getting political”). In the beginning there is ofen a lot of fervor without a lot of knowledge. But for some people, it is a necessary step towards a more mature perspective.

    • 189 JoJothecat
      October 13, 2011 at 12:10 am

      OH, and those that are 22 – 25yrs old are getting medical on their parents insurance thanks to, wait wait wait…..President Barack Obama!

    • 190 nathkatun7
      October 13, 2011 at 2:52 am

      I completely feel like you do, desertflower! Right now we have a highly partisan, highly mobilized, teabag-Republican party, dtermined to use every means necessary to defeat President Obama, and regain total control of all three branches of government. Believe me,
      (check out what has happened in Wisconsin, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida and Michigan) when Republicans regain complete control of government, the folks at OWS won’t know what hit them. At this time of serious economic hardships, liberals and progressives must unify and mobilizing people to prevent the teabag-Republicans from taking over in government, All we get is bitter rivalry.

  33. 191 collegekay
    October 12, 2011 at 8:04 pm

    Playing Devil’s advocate here — I don’t think this “poll” is credible (like any poll but who knows).

    • 192 nabsentia23
      October 12, 2011 at 8:24 pm

      Here’s the deal, collegekay…

      Is this movement equipped (in any fashion) to counteract this poll? You can never completely control what the press or others say about you, but come’on, does the OWS have the means to at least challenge what this article is saying?

      This is the 6 billion-dollar question.

      Thank you and goodknight.

    • 193 nathkatun7
      October 13, 2011 at 3:04 am

      O.K. Collegekay, suppose we concede that “this poll” is not “credible.” The question still remains: what exactly do leaders of OWS plan to accomplish by their numbers?

  34. October 12, 2011 at 8:46 pm

    My reading of this ‘poll’ – this movement will fail. No movement that is so clueless can survive.

  35. 196 isonprize
    October 12, 2011 at 9:53 pm


  36. 198 JoJothecat
    October 13, 2011 at 12:07 am

    I think these 99 people are lying that they follow Nader. I think these are Ron Paul supporters. I disagree that they voted for PBO. After the election and PBO won, I saw young adults with posters of PBO as Hitler at my local Ralphs and in front on the community College. They were promoting LaRouche who is also a Libertarian. This is a very pro-Obama city so I complained to the store manager that i did not appreciate that disgusting display.

  37. 199 Claire
    October 13, 2011 at 12:14 am

    I have no patience for eligible voters who don’t do their civic duty. I am not interested in their opinions.

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